Is it LEGAL????

Document, document, document.

Aside from things being a “manifestation of disability,” the other studetns are not receiving FAPE.

Unfortunately, pressure from teachers doesn’t often help. When I was in a similar situation, I was informed that “it is legal” and that no, it did NOT matter that students weren’t learning; all that mattered was that it was legal. Period. Parents are the ones with even a smidgin of at least hypothetical influence — but I think in that case (and I didn’t stay there) even a parent with ten good lawyers would have been fighting a losing battle because the school didn’t have resources any more than the parents did.

However, I did end up with my most serious problems getting other placements… well, not really the most serious; the ones who acted out most. (The most serious were a bit better at knowing when they could get away with things, so … well, you didn’t go into the mens’ rooms at that school.)

I kept a notebook with a daily record of the behaviors; I talked to the admins to find out just what I *could* refer students for. Didn’t help much; one time in seven, they’d get a few days at home which kept them under the “gotta meet for determination of manifestation of disability” thing, which was a cheerful reinforcement of their well-formed attitudes that discipline was an inconsistent crap shoot. Some of ‘em really could have turned things around had there been some consistency. Every couple of weeks I would send a letter up the chain of command, all the way to the superintendent (because he had said, at the beginning of the year, that he cared about that stuff). I would outline some of the behaviors and explain my deep concern that safety was an issue, and ask for any guidance and suggest that if a student or myself were injured, liability would be an interesting question.

Once in our most self-contained setting (classroom had a rest room so students weren’t supposed to leave for any reason), a student had a jolly time smoking non-tobacco substances in the rest room. Came out extolling the stellar quantities of the great stuff he had imbibed, reeking of same. Our admin response was “I have a meeting, sorry, I can’t come.” An hour and a half later, the admin walked in and said, “I don’t smell anything.”

We decided that if it happened again, we would call the state police directly (local ones would probably take similar actions; they knew these kids) for our own safety. It didn’t, though. I would consider asking the admins if that’s what you should do in the case of violent and/or intoxicated students.

And count the days…

I think the only leag remedy would be if the affected students filed a lawsuit against the school. They certainly have grounds because they are being deprived of an equal educational opportunity.

If it is legal in your state to do so videotape the clasroom activity. Certainly your school is in violation of the ADA but unfrotunately the only way the ADA gets enforced is through civil lawsuits filed by individuals or groups.

In most states the schools are required to provide an education for all of its students. If your job is made impossible then obviously the school is in violation of state and federal statutes plus some civil right violations.

You know how stressful the situation is for you. It is probably even more stressful for the students. Try contacting the ACLU or a civil right lawyer.

If you don’t want to get that involved for fear of reprisals from the administration put a bee in the parent’s bonnets to take legal action.

What neck of the woods are you in? I know in smaller cities (not all, mind you) all the students are in the same resource room. I grew up like that, actually. You should speak with the principal about what can be done under ADA because it is narrow minded to think that ld students and students with various hard core behavior issues should all be in the same room with one teacher. That is insane and you must seek justice that will help you as well as all those youngsters.

[quote:4edbc6a264=”merlinjones”]What neck of the woods are you in? I know in smaller cities (not all, mind you) all the students are in the same resource room. I grew up like that, actually. You should speak with the principal about what can be done under ADA because it is narrow minded to think that ld students and students with various hard core behavior issues should all be in the same room with one teacher. That is insane and you must seek justice that will help you as well as all those youngsters.[/quote]

Merlin,

I have heard that what Juliana describes is not all that uncommon. I think schools that stress football scores over reading scores are so shallow that they could ccare less about less talented and challenging students

What can we do for poor Juliana? That soudns mad, eh? Does anyone know of the laws that pertain to being threatened and whatnot?

Actually, I *did* smuggle in a tape recorder and keep a running log (which I erased as I reused the tapes). I figured that if things broke bad, I wanted documentation because students could and would make whatever claims would suit their needs, and they were a bit better at manipulating the system than I was. I did a Mark Twain version of informing them, even (lying by telling the absolute truth but not being believed); they assumed I was being sarcastic… tho’ I’m not totally sure they didn’t weigh the possibility into their actions.

I have decided not to renew my contract for next year. This is the same decision that about 10 teachers before me have made. I am putting my reasons in writing, and having it delivered to the Superintendent of the school system. I feel so bad for not going back to this class. I feel like I am giving up on them. However, after a long and agonizing talk with my mom (I may as well call her my therapist), I have decided that I can not stay in a situation I am unhappy with just to please others. I hope I am not doing the wrong thing. Let me know what you think. Of course, I know you all will be honest.

You can’t save the world. These kids won’t be the only one who fall through the cracks. Most do.

I think it is best for you to go where you can do the most good. You were in a lose lose situation. I guess that’s what happens when the school doesn’t care about doing its job.

I can certainly understand your frustration, Julianna. It is the same in most smaller districts, as well. Our county got a waiver to allow 15 students at a time in one classroom. Some of our general ed. classes are smaller. In the high school we have no categorical classes and all special ed. students with all disabilities are placed together in various departmentalized classes. And to make matters worse, we offer certain classes every other year, so that some grades are mixed together, as well. If a student has to repeat a class, they are are also put together.

The administration believes that behaviorly disordered should not be placed in a categorical class by themselves, as they feed off of each other. There is probably something to this, but I believe it is wrong to put them with CI and other disabilities, as there is not usually a behavioral program being implemented by the teacher outside of the usual classroom rules. Many of the BD students have individual behavior intervention plans, which make it virtually impossible to accommodate everyone all the time. Often times, placing BD students in the general ed. setting makes their behavior somewhat better, as they do not want to get made fun of by the other students. I usually ask, “What is our goal here, to educate students or to just house them?” No wonder the dropout rate among SE students is so high.

It is important to document everything that goes on. And make sure you have clear rules with consequences, and that you are consistent with the consequences. Parents are most likely the ones that will be able to make a change. But you can suggest a continuum of services that range from a categorical room, to resource rooms, to inclusion, whereby students needs are being met in the least restrictive environment.

Just beware, however, that most districts will not always want to start a new “program” due to the cost, especially if there are less than the maximum number of students being served. Seems contrary to what special ed. used to mean a few decades ago, huh?

I hear ya, Julianne, but do not give up in special ed. anyway. Make sure with the next position you apply for, that you are aware of the type of room it is, categorical, resource, inclusion, etc. This will give you insight as to what type of students and classroom management techniques you will have to implement.

and … make your first job interview at a school where you probably don’t want to work. I tended to ask too-pointed questions until the aura of my previous school wore off. (Not quite, “Do you ever back 8up your teachers?” but almost :-))

Good advice, Sue, to first interview at a school where you do not want to teach. That would be great practice! Wish I had thought of that 20 years ago!

[quote:5b511ab444=”WASETC”]I can certainly understand your frustration, Julianna. It is the same in most smaller districts, as well. Our county got a waiver to allow 15 students at a time in one classroom. Some of our general ed. classes are smaller. In the high school we have no categorical classes and all special ed. students with all disabilities are placed together in various departmentalized classes. And to make matters worse, we offer certain classes every other year, so that some grades are mixed together, as well. If a student has to repeat a class, they are are also put together.

The administration believes that behaviorly disordered should not be placed in a categorical class by themselves, as they feed off of each other. There is probably something to this, but I believe it is wrong to put them with CI and other disabilities, as there is not usually a behavioral program being implemented by the teacher outside of the usual classroom rules. Many of the BD students have individual behavior intervention plans, which make it virtually impossible to accommodate everyone all the time. Often times, placing BD students in the general ed. setting makes their behavior somewhat better, as they do not want to get made fun of by the other students. I usually ask, “What is our goal here, to educate students or to just house them?” No wonder the dropout rate among SE students is so high.

It is important to document everything that goes on. And make sure you have clear rules with consequences, and that you are consistent with the consequences. Parents are most likely the ones that will be able to make a change. But you can suggest a continuum of services that range from a categorical room, to resource rooms, to inclusion, whereby students needs are being met in the least restrictive environment.

Just beware, however, that most districts will not always want to start a new “program” due to the cost, especially if there are less than the maximum number of students being served. Seems contrary to what special ed. used to mean a few decades ago, huh?

I hear ya, Julianne, but do not give up in special ed. anyway. Make sure with the next position you apply for, that you are aware of the type of room it is, categorical, resource, inclusion, etc. This will give you insight as to what type of students and classroom management techniques you will have to implement.[/quote]

It sounds like in what you describe there are a host of civilrights and ADA violations that are too numerous to count.

The idea of putting disruptive students into a class of special needs students seems to be beyond stupid. It certainly is a civil rights violation if indeed children have any civil rights. It’s funny. If one of those students flipped out and did a Columbine they would be tried as an adult yet they are not given reasonable accomodation as prescribed by the ADA. Quite the opposite is true. They are actually given another impediment.

If you look at the question of equal protection it is easy to see that they are denied that as well.

I would also think that the school is in violation of several of its state’s education laws too. I am guessing that by law the school is obligated to give these disabled students an equal education. Again they only legal remedy I see is a lawsuit filed against the school district forcing the school district to pay for whatever it takes to get these disadvantaged kids an equal educational opportunity.

Somebody should talk to a civil rights lawyer.

I agree with what everyone is saying. Having LD & ED students together in one classroom is just not feasible! I currently have 15 students on my roster who range MR, LD, OHI, & ED. It is extremely difficult to work with students who are MR with an IQ of 55 when you have a BD kid with an IQ of 120 threatening another student.

I work in a very small urban district that only has a resource room. I recently got a student that was in a life skills classroom who is now in my class with my emotional support kids. It’s very tough because I try to focus on academics, but it is very difficult due to behaviors.

Julianna, I really feel for you. I say do what’s in your heart. If you’re not happy, then you need to find something that will make you happy. I agree with WASETC to not give up on special ed. Obviously you knew coming into it that it would be challenging.