behavior problem or LD problem? PLEASE GIVE FEED BACK

Submitted by an LD OnLine user on

I AM TRYING TO DETERMINE IF THE BEHAVIOR MY SONS ARE DISPLAYING IS FROM ACTING OUT BECAUSE OF AN LD OR SOME OTHER ISSUES (EMOTIONAL, ETC.)

[color=green]ok, the past two years of school have been very pressing. first basic background: i have two sons a year apart in age. i’m happily divorced. i did well in school and am currently working on my masters. their father, however, did not finish high school, nor did his siblings and his mother. my father and my sister have been diagnosed with ADHD. ANNNND we just moved from louisiana to florida in january. i used to be very on top of my game with homework for the kids even with ridiculously busy schedules, but last school year things fell apart due to tensions with teachers. this school year i am having a hard time getting on track[/color].

[color=darkblue]son#1: 11 yr old,5th grader, introvert, shy, low self esteem that appears to be improving (or is it), laid back but socialable. in second grade his teacher would conference with me and show concern because she said she has never seen a student like him (and she wasn’t all that young). sometimes she would give assignments (usually writing) in class and he would just sit there. he would never raise his hand to ask questions or anything. she explained to me that he is a C,D student (2nd grade didn’t use a letter grading system) now, this school was a very demanding school. by the end of second grade he had written 3 book reports. i had no problem with him doing homework with me. even with the book reports, i would thoroughly explain to him what he needed to do, then he would do it on his own. i coached him on asking questions and class participation and that improved. the next school year we bought a house and moved. the new school was more laid back. he made B’s and C’s in third grade. he did have to get his homework chart signed at the end of the day because he was failing to write all his homework assignments, but incomplete classwork was not a pressing issue. but then here comes last school year (unbeknowns to me he had been grouped in a class with the smart kids- not saying he isn’t smart- he’s extremely intelligent. at the age of four he wanted to know why we need god. BUT he was never an “A” kid. they claimed to have done this because of his previous year testing- which i wasn’t impressed with). his grades dropped immediately for a combination of additional reasons. some of it was in fact the child, but the teacher was equally at fault. when this child failed to turn in daily math worksheets i wouldn’t find out until i got a report card, even though he was getting 100% on his weekly work habits report. this among other things caused a great deal of tension between me, this teacher AND my other child’s teachers. in turn it caused me a great amount of stress and hence i began to fall short on dealing with homework. now we have moved, and he had a D in math and reading this past nine weeks (the first nine week period since being at a new school). after requesting a conference with the teachers i found out he earned a D in reading because he did not turn in more than half his class assignments (writing assignments)[i’m not understanding why the teacher didn’t call me and say, “hey, your son has been loosing recess and his grade is in jeapordy because of failure to complete assignments”. not to mention one teacher saying, “he is a good kid, so don’t be irritated with the child” - but obviously, something is not right. and if he is such a good kid, why does he choose not to do assignments. and if you know there is a real problem beyond his refusal to do work, why don’t you say when i ask what the heck to do to get this child on track?]. he displays little to no self motivation with the other subjects -unless assignments are computer related. he had C’s in everything else. also, he didn’t say anything about a science project until i found the assignment in his book bag a week before it was due- even though he saw me helping his brother with his. i also must mention that his handwriting is a god awful mess and does not improve even when you make him do work over as a consequence of poor handwriting. in addition to this, he has become more controlling of his brother (he always was, but it is ridiculous now). [/color]

[color=darkred]son #2: 10 yr old 4th grader, extravert, very much an entertainer and very talented in music, he occassionally says things that really makes no sense, AND he occassionally says things that appears to make no sense, BUT when he explains you are like whoa. he did extremely well in headstart, first grade, and did pretty well in second. like his brother, his handwriting is also not that great. it is a bit more legible, but he still sometimes capitalizes words like “the” in the middle of a sentence and many times fails to capitalize the beginning of his sentences, reverses the b and d (although he is beginning to catch himself with that). last year, in third grade (same year with confusion)i asked the teacher if she thought it was early signs of dyslexia. she never replied to the note i sent. when i asked her about it she said he is too smart, but she had the guidance counselor test him [even though i never signed any paperwork- hindsight]. after another month or two of asking and asking the guidance counselor, she finally said she did the test and he doesn’t have dyslexia. when i asked for a copy of the testing, the paper she gave was like “hunh?” but so much was going on, i guess i was lost at what to do. in addition to this, his grades began to fall and when i would conference with them they would say “he’s not paying attention; he’s like the absent minded professor; he might have ADD” but then when i go and get him tested outside of the school for ADD they are looking at me like i’m crazy and suddenly its not that he is not paying attention, it is that he is picking and choosing his subjects. now, the writing situation is so bad sometimes [not ALL the time] that once he had an open book test that he made a 90% on, but could have made 100%, but according to her paragraph long red ink comment “he obviously wasn’t paying attention because he had so many spelling and grammatical errors.” okay, now at this new school he has strong A’s in math and science, but in reading he has a D because of this spelling and grammar issue on an weekly OPEN book tests. i talked to his teacher this morning and explained that i was concerned there may be something more going on with his writing (last year he scored 1 out of 12 in the writing section on the state standardized test- well and/or exceptionally well in other areas). she explained that he just needs to practice writing more. they - especially boys- are all like that. but i was like sometimes he writes and makes no sense and you have to guide him through a writing assignment. after again reassuring me, i explained to her that i was concerned because it appears this nine weeks he will make a D due his writing on his reading tests. she told me they all have difficulty with that open book test. they just don’t want to use the book to find the answers. [i’m like if its like that then maybe you as a teacher need to try something else, but somehow i doubt its like that for most of the kids). [/color]

i have been fussing at my kids through all of this, demanding improvement, punishing, taking away privileges. nothing is working.

Submitted by JW on Sun, 04/29/2007 - 3:00 AM

Permalink

Hi, Dawn
I, too, am a happily divorced mother of 2 wonderful children. My daughter is 11 and my son is 7.

When my son was 5 he underwent neuropsych. testing. He is very intelligent, but had no social skills and was (still is) very defiant especially in school. He was diagnosed with a non-verbal learning disorder.

Last summer when he was six I enrolled him in a summer day camp that reinforces pragmatics, social skills, that most of us learn from observations. I didn’t know that many intelligent children with NLD just aren’t able to learn these skills in the same way many of us do. This school year he has continued meeting in a small pragmatics group once a week with 4 or 5 other boys his age that has helped tremendously. He still has his defiant moments, choosing what directions to follow and which ones to ignore, leading to conflicts in the classroom. And when he’s bored, he acts without thinking - one defiant day, he stuck a tack into a full water bottle, just to see what would happen! Needless to say, this didn’t turn out too well. He informed me, with a smile, that “it was a great invention - a squirt gun”. We agreed that it was a great idea, but at an inappropriate time and place. What else can you do with such a genius?!

The following information is from the pragmatics group website www.academynorth.com

A child’s emotional, physical, and social development can be enhanced through cooperative, non-competitive activities.

Through group discussion and play in a clinically structured environment, a youngster can build self-esteem, improve the ability to initiate and maintain interactions with peers, and improve social skills.

Activity-based groups help children solve problems, negotiate, and resolve conflicts.

While our group members are quite diverse, some of them have diagnoses such as ADHD, Executive Functioning Disorder, Asperger’s Disorder, Non-verbal Learning Disorder, Pragmatic Language Deficit and Anxiety Disorder. Children who attend the Academy North may benefit in the following ways:

Develop social skills and enhance team building
Acquire self-confidence
Learn more age-appropriate behavior
Improve problem-solving skills
Improve leadership skills
Recognize, label, and verbalize feelings
Learn appropriate assertiveness
Improve impulse control
Develop conflict management skills

Perhaps you can find a program in your area that can help children build self-esteem and peer relationships through cooperative and non-competitive activities. An internet search for counseling agencies and neuropsychological testing centers would be a good place to begin.

Good luck! You are not alone in this!
:) JW

Submitted by DAWN on Sun, 04/29/2007 - 2:34 PM

Permalink

[b][size=18]that’s it!!!!!!![/size]

thank you both for your response!!!! now, things make sense. ANXIETY. the child suffers from anxiety. my child’s self esteem was so low (still is just not as obvious) at one time that i used to just want to cry when i looked at him. even friends would say he looks depressed. he doesn’t sleep - much like his mother. i just have a high level of resillience (sorry for the misspell). this makes sense. i keep reading about LD’s and several things match the younger child, but i was searching for answers in the older one. i knew something was wrong, i just couldn’t classify it. i could see the low esteem, i just couldn’t make the connect to the anxiety. and with the school work i kept saying to myself, how could a child that i know actually cares behave as if he doesn’t? he is very smart he just can not handle pressure- like me. i could make honor roll in a regular environment, but put me in a high academic setting and i begin to shut down. his anxiety is apparently more pronounced than mine, but that’s what it is. ok. thank you god for the little light bulb.

THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!! sorry for the rambling. lol. typing and thinking at the same time.

Submitted by jnuttallphd on Fri, 05/04/2007 - 3:50 PM

Permalink

Dear Mom:

Having difficulties with reading, writing and spelling are frequently issues for learning disabilities/dyslexia. Very smart people can have learning disabilities/dyslexia. A book that helps explain this is Sally Shaywitz: Overcoming Dyslexia which can be purchased from Amazon.com.

Handing out punishments and taking away privileges will not improve academic performance if the issue is LD/dyslexia. The only thing that will help in the situations is tutoring and homework help.

I would deftly look for an outside evaluation since it sounds like the school in teachers are not responsive enough. You can also go to my web site for additional information. www.geocities.com/jnuttallphd

Jim
Dictated with Dragon NaturallySpeaking 9.0

Submitted by Josy on Fri, 06/01/2007 - 3:45 PM

Permalink

Do you still live in Florida? How are your kids doing with FCAT? You didn’t mention that so I guess they are passing and that is great. I know 3rd grade is the big year for retainment in grade or not. We have FCAT issues for sure. I just wondered how that was working for you. Some kids do good on FCAT and have a hard time with school. My child has a hard time with both. Some kids have a hard time with FCAT and school work and regular testing is easier. I’m not a big fan of FCAT for ESE, LD, IEP students.

I do think moving new schools, new teachers, new routine is hard. Some kids it’s no problem. It takes me awhile to learn the system in the school.

Submitted by DAWN on Fri, 06/01/2007 - 8:37 PM

Permalink

yes, still in florida. they both past. the younger child pulled all grades up and had all A’s but a C in reading (he had a D in reading for midterm because of his WRITING on his reading tests. when i asked his teacher if she thought there was a real issue with his writing ability she just said, “oh they all do that” –> WTF! lol).

the older son also passed, but he has major issues with writing as well as organization and time management. he had a D in reading 3rd nine weeks because he just shut down and wouldn’t complete writing assignments. after some coaching on my part, he pulled it up and got a B the last nine weeks, but maintained a D in math. and he is extremely inconsistent with performance. (on his WUR’s- writes upon request- the first time he made a 2, second time it was unscorable, thrid time 3.5. and if i never initiate communication the teachers won’t say jack. they just wait until i ask for a conference once i see these pitiful grades at the END of the nine weeks. and look dumb founded when i ask their opinion of the problem. our first 9 week report he had two D’s but there were no comments as to his effort, etc. the next report had ONE D and now all of a sudden they want to add several comments about him making no effort, etc. don’t wait until school is out! i mean, is it just me?) well, he is going to sixth grade next year. a whole new world. mercy.

because we just moved in january, test scores aren’t viewable online. so still waiting for hard copies of most tests. the younger child did get back his 4th grade writing scores. he was just below average, like a score of 2 something (level 2) on one part and then scored a 3.5 (out of 6) on the other part of that test.

but i’ve talked to the guidance counselor who was actually very helpful and i will try some things next year that should help us manage.

my main issue with the fcat is that i do agree there needs to be some amount of testing to determine accomplishments (or lack thereof) in the school system, but to fail a child despite their grades in class is ridiculous.

Back to Top