504s and ieps

Isn’t it all confusing? My suggestion is that you buy a good book about the IEP or special education maze. There are quite a few out there and you can find them on line at Amazon. Also if you want to borrow them instead of buy them you can look into an advocacy group in your area, generally they can direct you to a lending library for these items.

As for the process itself…well a 504 and an IEP are both protected by federal law. Both are written and the modifications you get in an IEP are available in an 504. The difference is that an IEP has goal and may provide special services while a 504 does not have goals to reach. There is another plan called an AIS, alternative intervention strategy. This has no federal protection behind it and has no real legal force. Our daughter who is dyslexic has an AIS. She receives no services and is extremely bright. Because she is in high school she does not want to push the issue right now, but understands that come SAT time she will need the additional time and only through a 504 can she get it.

Dr. Silver’s book “The Misunderstood Child” will help you a lot to be able to understand what tests have been given, what they measure, what the scores mean, and general advocacy.

After searching around for some time that is the info we finally were able to obtain. Good luck.

Annette,
My11year old did Not qualify for sevices at her 3 year evaluation, BUT I could keep her on an IEP with slight modifications in the classroom OR put her on a 504. The District Spe. Ed Person advised me to keep her on the IEP, becaue then she has a case manager that can follow up on her. My understanding is that with a 504 the regular classroom teacher has to provide any modifications etc. I just didn’t see that as an option, when the classrooms are full with approx. 30 kids. So she still has an IEP, but no extra services at this time her reg teacher or I can request help at anytime to be sure she maintains her goals on the IEP. I hope this makes sense.
My suggestion would to be to keep the IEP and hold off on the 504.

I have also been advised to keep our 13 year old on a full IEP versus a 504 plan. I have been told by LD personnel that an IEP has more teeth and is the more formal of the two documents. My son is gifted with dysgraphia and in all honors classes for academic subjects. His IEP is basically one objective and a list of accomodations. Our district also provides (because it is called for in the IEP) an AlphaSmart unit as an assistive technology. The unit is provided and maintained by the school district. My son carries it in his backpack just like any other notebook and uses it whenever he needs. All of the teachers have at least one computer in their classrooms so he can print his work via the classroom computer.

Getting folks to honor what the IEP says is a constant battle. I just stay as involved as possible, email folks immediately when things are not getting done and make sure everyone knows I will be in touch. My husband and I as parents must be our son’s advocates because there is no one else out there to do the job.

Annette,

First of all, by definition, an LD is a specific problem that causes a child with a normal IQ to be unable to perform at the level expected for that IQ. So a “below normal” IQ is NOT a sign of a learning disability.

Second, a VIQ of 118 isn’t in the “gifted” range, either. An IQ of 130 or higher is considered gifted. (That said, 102 is a little above average… 100 is average, and 118 is high average) So the information you’ve been given proves that this person either doesn’t know what she’s talking about, or is purposely misleading you.

Take it from a parent in MA who has been down this road. DO NOT agree to them taking him off his IEP. Let them take you to a hearing if need be. (they won’t, with minimal services, it’s cheaper to humor you, and they can’t take his IEP away without either your signature or a hearing with DOE)

When I knew less than I know now, I allowed my NLD son to be taken off his IEP with assurances from school staff that if he needed it, it was “easy” to reinstate. It took a year of battling with the school, and paying for a private neuropsych eval to get him back on the IEP that he never should have been taken off of. He too is bright, (VIQ 112) and does very well with the right support. Take that support away and he drowns. I still feel guilty that he had to prove that in 3rd grade.

Karen

Alda,

I am interested in learning more about the Alpha Smart unit. What does it do?
My daughter is 12 and very bright and has difficulty with writing. Typing isn’t any faster; however she prefers it. It might actually take longer. Scribing works great except I already have a full time job :).

Thanks for the details.

Do not go to a 504. Ask for another psych evaluation by an independant the district should pay for it depending on your local laws. For the person concerning the alphasmart, their great. They cost about $200.00 and they run on three AA batteries. It is difficult to lose information as it constantly saves your info. It is a wonderful tool that is a straight data processor. It is DOS so it can download to a PC or Mac. It can hold a lot of data, mine is an older one and it holds 68 pages of data on 8 files. What it does not do is format but you might want to check their website and see if the new ones do. They are great and far less tempermental than a laptop. Good Luck

A 504 plan has as much legal clout as an IEP. 504 is a part of the Civil Rights laws of this country. A major difference is that 504 does not require the mounds of evaluations and paperwork. that an IEP does and timelines, the number of meetings and the like are not regulated by law. In other words a 504 has less detailed regulations as an IEP but it does have as much “legal” authority since it is a part of the law of the US.

Hi,

I am trying to get a parent support group together regarding the IEP/504 issues in the Central MA area.

Please email me if your school isn’t supporting your disabled child. All disabilities welcomed.

Thank you.

Donna

Dear Karen Randall,

Your statement about giftedness and IQ are incorrect. You can not use an IQ test to say a child who has dual exceptionalities is not gifted.

A gifted child with an LD will have a depressed IQ score related to the LD.

Also there are various forms of giftedness. One can be gifted in one area and struggle in others.

There is some great articles on characteristics of twice exceptional children in the Eric clearinghouse. None of the experts in this area use IQ as a means of identifying this population.

Dear Karen Randall,

Your statement about giftedness and IQ are incorrect. You can not use an IQ test to say a child who has dual exceptionalities is not gifted.

A gifted child with an LD will have a depressed IQ score related to the LD.

Also there are various forms of giftedness. One can be gifted in one area and struggle in others.

There is some great articles on characteristics of twice exceptional children in the Eric clearinghouse. None of the experts in this area use IQ as a means of identifying this population.

Karen-

Did I get to tell you thatthis time around my 10 year old scored verbl IQ 131 Dear Karen adn all—This tme my younger oen actually testedat 131 Verbal IQ and performance 110? The composite was somewhere in between, I think at about 122. This time he showed an ld in viusal dn some other sequencing —but his processing speed wasn’t as slow as before (?). Ijsutt don’t get how it can be iffernt all the time every time. Well, I know some folks do not use any kind of Verbal Cognition score to put s-children in the Gifted or the Gifted LD categories— but this time teh pschologist said my young son was - very superior ( I think he was over the line above high average-maye they callthat superior superior- ut anyway. Nonetheless, the psychologist said there was some interesting work done on this by someone named bierley— I think. ANd she said the gifted LDs are “very,very rare.” I told her— if they are so rare, how come I have two ( out of two kids!) My older one has tested IQ verbal 138— but he tested even lower on performance about 106 or something. Anyway. it all doesn’t matter that much because they are both ADD- quite ADD—as am I.— I am just less so. My older one has managed to do very well in readign and writing creatviely and factually— I am a professiona writer ( even though you can’t tell from this mish mash) but that ADD can really be a nightmare unless it’s controlled well and before the child gets in the habit of not doin g the work. That too can be very much a problem even when meds and other interventions— nutritional behaviorial, etc are used. My younger one has seen what bad habits and ADD have done to his older brother and he is trying very hard to get into good habits…Well— just to put closure to all this—teh public school did not even use the two pronged approach—they jsut isolated the fact thatmy son has ADD “because his Dr.diagnosed it.” He wrote that my child is is doing well o a fairly large-not huge dose of ADDerallXR every day, etc and even though the school psychologist misdiagnosd him also having NLD ( which, when you know allabout NLD, it’s obvious asteh nose on his face that he has something quie different) He has a langauge based LD (but I guess it doesn’t matter right now 00 the teamjsut skippedteh whole prong -about his progress- pretty well -in school and decided to give him another IEP wihout skipping a beat—so all my worries were for nothing , Now I have to make sure it’s a good IEP and that it’s complied with. Writing and spelling are really hard for him—spelling is almost impossible=e and writing (composing) is very,very diffcult to say the least He’s getting typing which will help a lot. So, with a few pushes here and there I think I was very,very lucky. Who knows, maybe they didin’t want tocontend with me again or maybe they too jsut felt he needed an IEP-not sure — just know it could have been an awul event and it wasn’t.This is the very first time in all these years that it has not been very,very painful..Also, for anyone interested— This child who could not read approraitely and ws not at all was not reding ready etc and thus was labled dyslexic (which jsut means having troule reading for some reason—which was definitely true— when they wouldn’t give him anyhelp- i pulled him outof public school and put him in a prive Kindergardtenfor another year until I finally got him Wilson Language 5 days a week in public school one on one ( they didin’t want to give it to any other kids— who could have benefitted in a small group at he same time, oh well—my son did get it He had that for first adn seCond grade—and then I was told he progressed so well they would try to include him in the regualr reading prorgam—Well, I had already become a Wilson Certified tutor for others bythis time so I knew how well the program worked worked- but not quite …As it has turned out— my yougner one ( =and older one too) has/ have become excellent—even avid readers. Now that the 10 year old is in 4th grade— he tested in reading comprehension at 9th grade eight month level and in overall reading at 8th grade ninth month! And this was a kid who couldnot tell a T from a U even after two years of Kindergarten! Well Wilson does work as domanyoher such OG systems. It’s so wonderful to see him gain confidence and fluency. He’s even reading faster now— something my older child didn’t get til much later—as Isaid before I think the real villan here is ADD and the habits kids can form aroun =d it. Well iI am wiser now than I was once–and this coming fall I wil lbe a Special Education teacher in massachusetts—all because I have LD kids- I hope I can help other kids in ways that as a Mom I couldn’t help my own— AND help other kids in ways I did help my own. The ADD puzzlel isone that will soon be solved —maybe not in time for all the kids who have it now— but for many who will come along in the future—abd thereis even hope for us adults who have it- a little or a lot—it can really changee our lives in ways you might never dream of— but a life that has been scutinized and evalauted by its “owner” honestly can usually see it after a while — in the patterns….and it’s up to us to do the very best we can.

many thanks to everyone everywhere who helped me this time around whenI asked my questions about 504s and IEPs. Especially you.I still need to learn so very much more to make a difference…I will..I hope!
As ever,
Annette.

What a wierd situation. Gifted students are considered to be special education unless you live in a state that does not fund it. Gifted is not mandated by the federal government where learning disabilities is. Did you say he was currently on an IEP and as a result of the psy eval he no longer qualifies? If so, this is not legal. In addition, a score that you listed for IQ wouldn’t qualify for gifted in most districts. To get services for learning disabilities a student must have descrepancy between IQ and achievement - period. It doesn’t matter what the IQ is, unless it is in the retarded range. See if you can’t find an advocate to accompany you to the meeting, maybe a special educator from another district. I’m sure your state has a parent organization for parents of special needs children - contact them. This all sound very weird!