Do some children just not learn?

That should say “He was NOT making 80% on spelling.”

He has never reached even this goal. Even as the words get easier and easer.

Well, the first is correct for all kinds of good reasons — you really can’t predict a child’s specific progress.
Big however: some progress *is* expected, especially with the cognitive strengths your son shows in the WISC .

THe second is sorta true — you don’t use the exact same achievement test from year to year. However, tests such as the Gray Oral Reading TEst and teh Woodcock Johnson have an A and B version so that they can be used from year to year. Odd that the school should resist something that would “inflate” scores….

THe third is of course, a choice phrase. Yes, I’ve had kiddos who made *slow* progress (even w/ high IQ’s)… but they did make progress and there were “un-plateaus” in the middle of the plateaus where they put lots of things together and made good strides.

Now is the time to wax cool, calm and documentary.
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Oracle/1580/documentation.html has the tools and directions.
Another good place to look — but don’t be overwhelmed — is
http://www.wrightslaw.com/ .

It’s too common for the frustration and anger to go unchanneled; your first reality check is that schools really *do* run this way and there ain’t no Big Principal to come in, blow the whistle, and straighten them out. Yes, it’s unfair. Yes, it’s reality.

Dear Very Worried Mom,

This likely is not a case of a child who cannot learn. This is a case of gross incompetence of a school.

It is insane that he only had one goal and it was for spelling. However, I would have to ask you, were you present for that IEP meeting? A parent has the right to input when the goals are being determined and if he is LD in written expression, there surely should be MORE goals and objectives than one! You probably should have refused to sign the IEP if they weren’t going to put more than a spelling goal.

Next, the mess up in second grade was big. With a 40 point verbal/performace discrepancy, the full scale score should NOT have been used. The higher of the verbal or performance score should have been used. This kind of verbal/performance difference is significant. The fact that they ignored it boggles my mind.

Is he reading well? You only mention written expression but I wonder about his reading scores. How about math? Kids with very low performance scores often have trouble in math, too.

You need to read the Wright’s law site and get yourself educated on your rights. These people are telling you things that aren’t true. They don’t want measurable objectives because they apparently don’t know how to meet them. However, that said, there are some kids who simply have such poor visual memory skills that they never learn to spell well, and there comes a time that they need to be taught accommodations. But I am venturing to guess that your child has more wrong than just spelling if he qualified in written expression. Spelling alone generally is not enough to qualify as LD in written expression. But you do need to be very specific about these goals: like can he write a grammatical sentence?, a paragraph?, use correct punctuation?. Just saying he will increase written expression by one grade level is very vague and I would have no idea what his needs are just from that. The present level of performance needs to list exactly what he can and cannot do in the area of written expression. Then the goals and objectives are based on the skills he needs to improve.

They are full of a word that I don’t say when they tell you that they can’t use a standardized test yearly. That is a lie and one which you must resist. If they say it again, just ask them to show you in the manual where it says that. Almost any test can be give once a year and come can be regiven after 6 months, so don’t fall for that. Teacher observation proves NOTHING.

I am always one who says to try and be nice and keep on good terms with a school. But I think your case is one that needs an advocate. I think you need someone knowledgable to attend the next IEP meeting. They are railroading you and that angers me. You also have a pretty good legal case to win some private services as the school has illegally denied your son service as well as failing to help him improve. But I would find a special ed. advocate first.

But do tell me about what his specific academic problems are so I can answer a little more specifically.

Janis

A child with that IQ can learn! He has not been provided with curriculum materials and teaching strategies suited to his needs.

Is there any chance you could homeschool? You’ve lost a lot of time. Chances are that you will have to fight very hard to get anything useful from this school, and in the meantime your son will be losing. Direct remediation at home can be much more effective than what most schools can offer — even good schools — especially if you can afford some special programs.

If homeschooling is an option, I will list programs and curriculum materials to check out.

Nancy

To your basic question:
A kid with an IQ like this can and does learn, period. Your school is giving you a real runaround. Definitely check Wrightslaw site.

In general: you mention the spelling. How is his reading? How is his math? How is his oral language? How is his general knowledge? Does he have any physical problems? Does he have any vision or hearing issues?

Post a little more info and we can all try to give more specific answers. Thanks.

Thank you all for your answers! I really, really appreciate the help and suggestions.

I did decide that this is all over my head. For the longest time I trusted the “experts” at school. I guess its time I became my own expert!

I have retained an advocate. It was a necessary step. We are meeting to go over this child’s IEP and try to get him the help he deserves. The sites you gave me, Sue, are helping me get up to speed.

He’s a complicated kiddo…reading speed is on level, comprehsion above. He’s poor at math problems but has a great math sense…he was recently put in the advance math and loves it. Its mostly word problems and although he sometimes has problems with the calculations he always, always knows what he needs to do to get the answer. As for physical issues, yes, a few. Poor fine motor control (although not bad enough for the school to do therapy, we are looking at that outside right now) and articulation problems with speech. He recieves speech therapy both in and out of school.

I’m not sure about the homeschooling piece but would like to learn more. Can you recommend a site or something.

A less worried mom.

http://www.resourceroom.net/homeschool/index.asp has some links for your situation :-)

http://homeschooling.gomilpitas.com/directory/Beginning.htm is also a good starting point — this lady has gobs and gobs and gobs of (overwhelming) stuff on that site.

3) Some children just don’t learn. My son has proven himself to be just such a child. I am expecting to much of him and the school.

Have you ever had a child who could not learn?

Not one with an IQ of 128. Your child is likely quite bright and is likely learning many things. I’d ask - what skills are his weak ones? Reading? Spelling? Writing?

If so, I’d guess your son does have some learning differences. You can write the IEP to say whatever but that doesn’t mean the school can get the job done. While I’ve never had a student who couldn’t learn, I have had students who couldn’t learn to read well or write well in our school. Few schools have many methods or approaches and not every child responds to the instructional methods of their own school.

With all of their testing, someone should be able to tell you what learning differences your child is manifesting.

good luck.

Hello Scared Mom,

Try www.dyslexia.com

My daughter was just such a “hopeless” student, at least so saith the SpEd teacher…She responded to Davis Dyslexia Correction…a method, I must warn you, that the method is unpopular with the traditional education community. However, most of their objections are based on gut feelings, never having actually researched the method…”I can’t imagine what ‘playing with clay’ could have to do with reading.” Well, my daughter “couldn’t imagine what making noise” had to do with it either.

Check out [u]The Gift of Dyslexia[/u] by Ron Davis and Eldon Braun. If you find your child on the pages of that book, the method will probably be effective.

While some people have responded favorably to Davis, it isn’t a research based method. I’d suggest you look into Orton Gillingham or another research based method. There are some good links on reading on this page, so you might check these out.

—des

I have a Learning Disability and oen way i think you can tell is if he is really trying or is he using the idea that you think he cant do it to get out of doing the work. For me I have to hear and see what I am trying learn, you might try that may be.

kathleen
[email protected]

I am a new writer at this site.

I just want you all to know that you may have a child with a vision problem. Please go to www.pavevision.org for more information. If your child has a vision problem, it can be corrected with Vision Therapy. Good luck!

New writer, please be advised that your first post was informative — when you’re responding with a plug for all occasions, that’s pushy and rude. Hang around, chat with us — or make your one post and go your merry way. I for one will have a lesser opinion of PAVE if it’s shoved down my throat.

I started teaching 2 years ago and one of my LD student’s parents told me that the year before she was told by the SpecEd teacher that her son “would never get it.” Turns out the kid had learned to work the system and was babied and coddled until no one had any expectations of him at all and therefore he got out of doing work or really trying to learn anything. The regular ed teacher and myself held high expectations for this child and his skills just took off. When the mother told me what had been told to her previously, I was appalled. I said, “Well, now you see that that is not true.” She was very pleased with his progress because she had been told, and consequently believed that he couldn’t learn.

Even children with low IQs-those referred to as “Trainably Mentally Handicapped” or “Educatably Mentally Handicapped” can learn certain skills that will enhance their lives (such as life skills, socail skills, etc.) The trick is to find out what type of learning style the child has, what his/her needs are and try to provide supplementary activities or programs that address this. That is what “Individualized Education” is all about. Your situation sounds like part of the reason the laws and guidelines of IDEA were written.

As a parent, you have rights under the law. The suggestions listed here about educating yourself on your rights under IDEA or hiring a professional advocate are good ones. As a teacher I have to be careful what I push my administration for (I want to keep my job!) but I try to help empower the parents of my students, because it is them, that can truly make changes in the system.

Alll kids can learn! Anyone who says different is is the wrong profession! Just my opinion

Best of Luck to you-keep pushing and don’t give up!