Looking for advice on attending my first assistance team mee

of course your like this,any body would. I would suggest doing exactly this. Go to the meeting,tape it,and without making any decisions,leave and think it over,and ask those questions you didn’t think to ask in a form of a letter. You don’t have to make any decision until your ready to make it. As a parent you are by LAW an equal member of this team meeting. In fact you know more about your child then they do. It is a wise decision to sit back and listen,then go home and think about what was said,what they are offering,and whether you agree with this or not. Then and only then to you go back to the table and discuss what is acceptable and what isn’t. Good luck!

Schools can be evasive. I would gently suggest you be alert for pleasant evasion. Does your school know she’s been tested on the outside?

To me it sounds like first, you’d want to fill them on why you took her to this doctor. What were you seeing?

The one question I’d ask - after giving them the information you have - is… now that we know this, how will you factor this knowledge into what you’re doing with?

You could even be so specific as to pleasantly ask - tell me one thing you’ll be doing differently now that my daughter is known to be anxious?

Is it thought that her anti-anxiety medicine will “cure” her anxiety? Or will it help her to manage it? If it is expected that her medication will help her to manage it, school deserves to help her help herself manage it.

Try to find out how they’ll do that.

Good luck.

All prior post advice is sound, so pay attention ;)

Furthermore, do not feel obligated to sign any document, regardless of the pressures. This of course does not include signing a document that states you were in attendance. That would be fine, but be certian you are not signing something that states objectives or criteria regarding your child’s education. Let folks know, in plain and simple terms, you wish to go home, review the tape and you will advise them, in writing of any and questions that may come to you over the next day or so.

Be very kind and non-confrontative. Let them know that you will respond quickly, and ask how long it may take to hear back from them regarding your questions. It will be good for you to have these things in writing, in regards to your questions and their responses. Request in your follow up letter that they respond to you in writing as well, so you can take time to absorb the information and understand fully what is going on. Be honest and let them know that you do take your child’s education seriously, and you intend on being as informed as possible.

Another consideration is bring a friend, relative or someone objective who can sit quietly (and knit or something), not be involved, but lend and ear so you can bounce off of them what it was you thought you heard etc… Someone who is level headed and not too emotional is a plus for some of the meetings.

Anyway, follow your gut instincts, don’t get too worked up over thinking things.
Bring your wits, and wit with you. As tough as it is to comprehend, keep your emotions as in check as you can, so as to not get clouded with matters that will distract you from your initial objective.

If you are going to tape record, I beleive you need to give them 24 hour notice that you wish to record the meeting.

Good luck.

Andy

The tape recorder sounds like a great idea. I will not bring one for this meeting; but I will ask the AT if it is OK to bring one in for future meetings. I was not expecting to sign papers. I am glad to know that information in advances.

Unfortunately, I am the only person that can attend the meeting. My husband has to work and my Mom will be watching my two daughters. The rest of the family lives about one hour to six hours away from us. I wish there could be someone else at the meeting. I have been feeling overwhelmed by all the doctors visit in the past two and half months.

Some background….(I will try my best to make this short) Yes, the school knew that daughter was going to be seen by a behaviorist. The school/my daughter’s teacher is very well informed of what’s going on. The teacher approached me at the beginning of the school year to take my daughter to a “neurologist”. I later found out (at the neurologist office) that the school, thought my daughter was having petite mal seizures. My daughter had a EEG. EEG came back normal. Neurologist said my daughter was ADD and I should see the behaviorist that practices in the same building. (Which is what I did but it took one and half months to get my first appointment. The appointment was last week.) I go back to my daughter main pediatrician. We filled out a ADD/ADHD checklist. It was determine if daughter was ADD then it as very mild. So he offered the medicine, addarell (sp?). It did not help her. She was only on it for three weeks. We have two more doctor appointments. On Nov. 13 my daughter will see an allergist and she evaluated by a occupational therapist on Nov. 20.

This is a great messages board. I am very shocked and very appreciated of the number of responds I received. Thank you all. I am sure I will be back to ask more questions.

Jennifer

Very often a random EEG will show normal,even though the person could be experiencing seizure activity at other times. A very good study to do is an EEG under video survilence. It is done as a hospital stay,the EEG monitoring is done 24 hours per day for a period of time,this sometimes shows seizure activity that wasn’t eveident with a random EEG. Might want to ask about this. Especially if she might be experiencing petit mal seizures. Some kids will have siezures during sleep.

Socks, can you provide more information about evaluation for absence seizures? My very unmedical opinion is that one of my students may be having these, despite a recent, clean EEG.

Obviously, I’d prefer that seizures were not an issue for this child, but if it’s the testing that’s flawed, I don’t want to be unfairly harsh when my student has difficulty concentrating and/or space out.

My student will be seeing a neurologist next week. Is there any specific information you think I should provide to mom (outside of my notes regarding these episodes?)

Thanks,
Karyn

Here is the best explanation I have run across.

When To Call A Professional

Call your pediatrician or family practitioner if you notice that your child has “staring spells,” brief periods of deep “daydreaming” or other behaviors that may be symptoms of absence seizures.

If your child’s teacher complains that your child is “not paying attention,” “tunes out” or “always daydreams,” ask the teacher whether your child shows other symptoms of absence seizures. For example, does your child stare straight ahead at the chalkboard, blink repeatedly or twitch while “daydreaming”? Request that the teacher write down a detailed description of your child’s symptoms, including an estimated duration for each episode and the number of episodes per day. Once you have received this description, check to see whether you notice any of these same behaviors when your child is at home. Then call your doctor to discuss the situation.

Prognosis

The prognosis is very good. Most children with absence epilepsy eventually outgrow the condition without complications. With proper treatment, the child can have a normal life at school and at home. In most cases, there is no long-term effect on brain development, brain function or intelligence.

I appreciate the input. Sounds like what I’ve been doing!

Is an assistance team like a child study team? We have this committee that helps teachers with students about whom they are concerned. We can recommend assessment.

I don’t think this kind of meeting has the status of an IEP meeting in any way. I don’t think anyone signs documents, we generally take notes and write suggesitons and who will do what, if anything is being done. I personally think taping this meeting is inappropriate and will signal the school that you intend to be a parent who will buck them, sue them, etc. Unless you have a good reason to expect to be shined on, I would go, contribute and be cordial, I would not tape. This is not a “legal” team like an IEP team.

You have the right request a full assessment. Take a letter requesting assessment and your reasons why you believe this is necessary. They MUST respond to this.

FYI, doctors are becoming more more presumptious, thinking that they can write prescriptions for schools. They can provide valuable information from a MEDICAL point of view, a note from a doctor does not carry the weight that a note from a parent does. The school can read the doctor’s note and say,”that’s nice.” but they have 15 days to respond to your request for assessment.

First off; “peace” Anitya. I come bearing olive branches in my teeth, as I am typing with both hands :)

Only responding to the one point…

The point about tape recording was directed at her own mention that she needs time to think things over, review what she thought she heard and make decisions. Tape recording is a useful tool for those with (possible) ld issues and otherwise to go back over and not assume, but be certain of what she heard.

How it is proposed, non-combantant style, shouldn’t raise any hackles or concerns; unless other motives were otherwise intended at the meeting.

Having been at the recieving end of being strong armed in a meeting that wasn’t an “official” IEP, I can testify to wishing I had brought a tape recorder. Having ld issues and staying up countless hours going over and over what I thought I heard with my wife, versus being sure, is another reason for wishing I had a tape recorder.

If a tape recorder is an acceptable means for a tool for a child to use to learn in class, then it should be an acceptable tool for a parent of an ld child to use in a classroom… I would think.

Had to reiterate Andy’s response here. After reading Anitya’s post,the first thing I thought was; “oh,how I wished I had brought my tape recorder to my child’s CST meeting”.

This was the meeting in which the eligibility issue is discussed. While it is not an IEP,it is probably more important.

Again,if taping makes one defensive,one must wonder why? It will hopefully be written into IDEA soon. As it stands, it is up to the State to determine whther to allow tapes or not.

there is a petition to get tapping into the revisions:
http://www.petitiononline.com/CROSS001

Parents are at enough of a handicap(excuse the pun) then not be allowed a way to either review what happened,or simply have an accounting of what was said. It’s always amazing,I say always,because tooo many parents have been in the same spot. When noone remembers saying this or that.
When time for the IEP,and teachers are told,no more children in the resource room,and they sit and try and convince the parents of a child who needs help,that he or she doesn’t. Well,like I said,wish I had a tape of my cst’s.

No problem with that, however, 1) an assistance team is not making decisions. If it is what I think it is, then it is a meeting where the teacher (parent) share the child’s strengths and concerns. This is then recorded. 2) suggestions for things to try in the classroom, home are made. The team may suggest testing.

This should have little to nothing to do with assessing or determining an LD. The parent would have the right to a copy of the notes. We write down everything considered/discussed on an overhead projector, then xerox copies for all who need them, one for CUM and one for teacher, parent, etc.

This parents HAS the RIGHT to request testing and the school pretty much cannot turn her down, unless they have a very strong reason with backup support for their reason. If the parent is turned down and the school disagrees, the parent can reinterate request and the school would be a fool to turn down twice, unless this child has SAT 9 scores and grades all above average.

Going into the first meeting on your child, armed with a tape recorder, regardless of your good intentions, appears adverserial. If a parent walked into our child study team meeting where we were expressing concerns and suggestion interventions, I would be surprised and suspicious if they pulled out a tape recorder. I might say very little to nothing, for fear of how the parent might use this instrument.

The notes, such as we take, are pretty extensive. Parent could take notes and rearead them to the team for clarification w/o raising any suspicions.

My point is “why suggest an adverserial situation when there is no reason to do so?” This will put everyone on alarm with respect to this parent every time she comes to school, for a long time.

Lastly, if you think the parent might make a show of strength and power by bringing along the tape, ostensibly to review the meeting later (notes do this just fine), consider whether or not intimidation is a good approach this early on in a case. Has this parent been pushed around, bullied or shined on by the school? Is intimidation appropriate at this time? And this would appear to be, if I were sitting at that table, intimidation.

Dad, come on, we school people are not that stupid. We know anybody armed with a tape recorder is taking permanant evidence. How much do you think we will say?

I’ve taken tape recorders to IEP meetings and I have not. Seems to me that the inappropriate things never get said when the tape recorder is on. Still, I don’t know if I would take one to the first meeting personally for the symbolic reasons you cite. I didn’t take one until after I had hired an advocate—in other words, it was clear that things weren’t going to work very easily.

In the first district I had my son, I never would have dreamed of taking a tape recorder. They worked with me in the best interest of my child. Personally, even having experienced both, I would try to assume the best and change your tactic only after you see that it won’t be an easy road.

Beth

let us know how it went. I read the posts above. I heard that the school has expressed concerns, they do not appear to be in denial that you child very likely has some issues. I also heard from parents that you should be “on guard” ready with your tape recorder and all the baggage that goes along with the parent vs. school consciousness. As a resource teacher I have sat in on many meetings where school personnel have been helpful to appreciative parents. We are not all ogres. I think you must be alert and aware, prepared, but to adopt a suspicious, us against them view at the outset of what might be a productive relationship could derail a potentially good start on meeting your child’s needs.

So, how did it go? Are they testing for LD or what? What evidence does anyone have at this time that there is an LD? I have worked with anxious youngsters who learned to read just fine. Anxiety is not synonymous with LD, however the two can occur together.

When I first became a sped teacher, my mom was going through treatment for a very aggressive form of cancer. After the first one or two meetings with doctors, she was so overwhelmed that she began bringin a friend and taping all of her appointments. She just couldn’t focus on everything that was being said in the high pressure environment of the doctor’s office.

For this reason, I always encourage parents to tape record and/or bring a friend to meetings, particularly when they are new to sped services. Even in the most congenial meetings, there is just too much said for any one person to retain. There is a benefit to being able to go back and digest the content of a meeting at your leisure in the comfort of your own home. I think that it’s too bad that trying to be on top of things is so often seen as a red flag in special education.

The funny thing is, many parents who have routinely taped meetings in previous years don’t tape my meetings, even when I tell them to!

A hostile parent bringing a tape recorder into a meeting changes the entire perspective of a meeting. I can guarantee you that I become very defensive, very careful and thereby considerably less creative knowing anything I happen to say in the thousands of words spoken in a meeting can and will be held against me in court.

Cooperative meetings even under harsh circumstance have in my career produced far more than contentious meetings. As staffing specialist my job was to uphold the law, see that proper and adequate services are legally provided, and insure that a legal and appropriate plan is developed. More often than not, extremely contentious parents had more issues of their own than those of advocating for their child. (I worked primarily behavior disorders - with severely abused children - and, of course, I know this has biased my opinion.)

Time constraints limit my ability to repsond in normal perseverating manner…

I don’t think that anyone intended for the parent to go in with the tape recorder and be hostile. She specifically noted in her post that she had trouble retaining all that she hears and required time to think things over. The tape recorder is a tool for learning disabled people. Clearly all of us ld’ers are not behavioral problems. It’s pretty common knowledge that many ld matters are passed on genetically.

I’ve attended more than my fare share of meetings where the administrators and teachers (not all) have taken an extremely hostile position and displayed far more behavioral issues that you address than we parents. In fact, we never were hostile, confrontative or abusive (like we were treated), instead, simply held the position of focusing on our child.

I have no issue with your point about hostile individuals in a meeting changing the focus and obstructing the efforts to help the child. I do find it interesting that as soon as a parent tries to balance the playing field, it is automatically taken as an offensive of hostility.

You may not be party to the same group we dealt with. I have been through mediation and due process and have the transcripts and tapes (that are done officially there) where both administrative people and teachers flat out lied under oath regardless of the tape recorder. In an informal type setting, if you are not misleading the parent, or saying something you would deny you said later… why would it matter if the meeting is tape recorded.

As a parent, particularly, as an ld parent, when you are sitting in a room at the district office, with possibly as many as 11 school employees, it can be considered intimidating (by some), it can be confusing when all sorts of information is thrust at you, and it does take some doing to understand all that is going on.

This is not to say that all teachers and administrators lie or abuse parents (although many can attest to this happening), this is only to say that a parent who takes the time and energy to try and work with the district to help their child is not being hostile (generally speaking, but not all inclusive).

Doesn’t it make more sense that the abusive, non-caring parent would have to be dragged into the meetings to address their child’s needs?

Don’t you find with your experience of abusive parents that they tend to hide from the authorities and lie when confronted? What sense does it make to have an abusive, hostile parent walk into one of the only places where a child should be protected and have a safety net there from a group of people whose focus is the best interest of the child?

I don’t know, just rambling… and wondering… Why does it always get twisted at this point, and then the battle lines are drawn?

Parents who question about their child’s program (IEP is for INDIVIDUAL), do not imply that the teacher is bad, or inneffective; they simply are crying for help because they see their child floundering and they are begging for help.

Please, I’ve met your district “consultants”, I know how they prep you and to what lengths they force you to go when it comes to a hearing. I know about the pressure tactics, threats of losing one’s job, being transferred, and the failure of a union to protect you from doing what should be done; looking out for a child vs. the beaurocracy. I do not wish to get into any arguments or continue, but only to clarify that there are extremely devious people within your system; more than likely you know some or at least of them.

If you are not devious and have no alterior motives, I don’t understand why a parent with ld issues (or not) tapes a meeting. If you have nothing to hide, why would you punish the parent and subsequently the child by not speaking your mind. If you are concerned with a parent manipulating a tape recording, you have every right to have the district tape record the meeting as well for balance. I doubt you would say anything you’d regret, and with a copy, if the parent were being decietful or plotting destruction without proper “evidence”, your copy would clearly show the entire picture and your presumed guilt would be demolished. The guilty party would then be exposed.

With all that goes on in normal everyday life, I find it hard to imagine that a parent has that much extra time to simply plot to destroy and district and go out of their way to plan so deviously. Although, as things go, I bet they are out there too!

We haven’t been through the training programs, we haven’t learned the jargon or the procedural protocols; we are victims of loving our children and wanting to help them to not fail and to survive what can be extremely truamatic years.

I think the system is set up to start this conflict between parent and teacher at first contact, to alter the game, to change the focus, to keep the child within the system, so the ADA can be collected and the beaurocracy can flourish. I just get real sad knowing how many children and families get abused, crushed, ignored and flushed through, vs. being encouraged to seek help and appropriate programs.

Forcing the square peg in the round hole. It can be done, but at what cost.

Just my opinion, based on my experience…

that’s all.

“Dad, come on, we school people are not that stupid. We know anybody armed with a tape recorder is taking permanant evidence. How much do you think we will say?”

Plenty.

I have gotten some very amazing things on tape. I tape everything, whether formal or informal meeting. I have a permanent blanket notice of intent to tape on file at the District Office, with the Sped Director, and in the local school.

In the heat of the meeting, if I have to take notes, i am not hearing what is being said to rebut. The tape frees my attention to work on the content and not just write down the words. I have also seen where the notes taken are sometimes incomplete, and pointed out a couple of considerable discrepancies between the copies of the schol’s notes I received and the actual transcripts of the meeting. Caused a little embarrassment for the Sped Director too, when I brought this up in a subsequent meeting (I will admit to human weakness and say that I did feel a little twinge of satisfaction when she had to eat her words and admit that she did say what she had just denied saying).

I do not assume that any of the people on the otherside of the table are stupid. I plan on them being very smart, and very sly. I have relistened to tapes several times to properly digest what is said, and have seen how subtle some of the verbal tricks can be. By taping, and then reviewing, I am able to better prepare for the next round of meetings.

Some examples of the amazing things I have captured on tape…

District personnel asking me to back date forms to comply with prior notification (every IEP/ARD meeting I have ever attended).

Admission of falsifying records to give the appearance of compliance.

Admission that the IEP programs were left unaccomplished.

Admissions that the staff have no training for working with a child with my boy’s disability (autistic non-verbal).

Admission that my boy received no individualized instruction during the course of the school day.

Admission that OT was not performed at all for a period of 5 weeks.

Admission that my boy was intentionally misclassified to keep the State from auditing the district.

Admission that the information I supplied at an earlier meeting concerning discrepancies between District and State policy was accurate in favour of the State’s position.

Admission that the school personnel were in over their heads, and no change was to come.

Admission that the “autism expert” the District hired to work with my boy after we pulled him from their generic program had no experiance whatsoever with autistic children, and would rely upon “asking a friend in another state” when something came up.

I tape all meetings with the tape recorder in plain view on the table. When need be, I use it as a psychological tool to throw them off their adherance to script. When it becomes obvious that questions are not being answered, but the person is jist saying what they have been instructed to say, I may turn the tape recorder to face them, reminding them that I am capturing their words exactly as they say them. I may also make a small show of changing the tapes, breaking out the little tabs to prevent accidental erasure and labeling them as they speak.

The process of IEP, ARD, etc. is stacked heavily in favour of the existing status quo. Memorex can help me level the playing field, and I will always advocate that all parents buy a protable recorder and tape everything they attend which involves their children’s education.

Your message is honest and nice to read. Thank-you for all the benefits of doubt you gave me. I understand your point and after having read this site for a couple of years kow just how hostile some districts and their personnel can be.

We have no argument. You realize there are those of us who would fight as hard as we know how for the benefit of the kid. If a district is abusive, I know how to walk. I do not know how to compromise very well - not on the basics at least.

Abusive parents often like to abuse the world around them. Believe me they show up at meetings, sometimes even with well-intentioned (often naive) advocates. They show up perhaps to find out what exactly we have on them. In their fear of getting caught, perhaps they want the reassurance that we’re not on to them. (And you know, we can’t pursue until we have the evidence. Intuition and experience doesn’t count for much in a court of law.)

In an honest meeting, video-taping only tends to hamper the creative process. All the more when I realize that anything I may say in that two hours could be taken out of context and distorted. In such a setting I cannot admit the failure of others in my district and work with that parent, child, and team to correct it. We, too, have mouths to feed and must choose our battles.

thanks for the good response - Ken

Very cool response, Ken. Glad we could locate common ground here. What I wrote was done at 0430 am, Friday, after a pretty long week of long days at work. I’m somewhat amazed, yet pleased, that the sentances came together and made some sense :)

I too understand what you are saying, and it is amazing how twisted the focus of things can become, when, in the begining, all those involved have the same intentions (at least for the most part).

The monsters that abuse children need to be adressed and called on the carpet for their actions. I use this term universally, for both parents and administrative bullies who beat the crap out of parents at these meetings. There are too many of us out here/there in the larger community of this country who have had very bad, ugly experiences with districts to make this an individual experience and say “it doesn’t happen here”. If it does not happen in your specific district, then I choose to believe YOU and YOUR DISTRICT are the exception, and you need to have a little more understanding of what does go on out THERE. However, in the same breath, those of us who have been bullied, abused, lied to, coerced, manipulated and basically throttled by the system have a hard time understanding that a parent could demonstratively harm their child; for we have opted to stand alone and face a huge beaurocracy, at great risk to emotional, psychological and financial harm, simply to try and reason to help our floundering child. It is quite a cunundrum.

The irony, is I still feel it is inherent in the system, as it was designed, or how it has evolved, to self-perpetuate by strong arming any or all who question the system itself or it’s employees (teacher or administrator). It reminds me of the old Star Trek where the computer takes over the ship and will not allow itself to be destroyed or shut off, no matter what the cause. The initial cause is long forgoten, and help to improve is not considered valuable, but a threat and challenge to be terminated. It is a fundamental flaw that effects all, regardless of motives.

You mentioned that you would be concerned something could be taken out of context regarding something said about an associate, for example. I bet you know of certain individuals, who probably are not the best people to put on the front lines with children, where specific instances have made you question why they are teaching (for what ever the reason), certainly they are not the same bright eyed idealists they were when they graduated, but, due to tenure and protections, it would only get ugly if their transgressions were brought out to light. I find it horribly ironic, that a good person’s/teacher’s intuition or instinct regarding this type of matter would only backfire and cause great harm and problems, when, again, the intial objective of teaching the child is long since thrown out with the proverbial bath water. Same goes for the parents. What ever happened to erring on the side of caution, in the hopes of protecting a child. Without going overboard, of course.

Again, I just find it highly ironic that at first blush, when a parent questions a district, the initial response is to clam up, lock arms, don’t question us, we know what’s best… (this is not all of you, please don’t start with me). This is the general perception we parents get when the meetings fill up with many of “you”, and one or two of “us”. We ususally aren’t saying someone is “bad” at teaching, we are pleading for help for our child who is floundering, and we seek help; either within your system, or somewhere else.

These are rhetorical quesitons.

If our child cannot learn without injury, or up to the higher end of his/her degree of abilities, why is it such a crime to ask to move our child to another environment?

What is the great crime of releasing the funding for what ever educational process best meets the needs of our child?

Why must the district take the position of destroying the parents and family at all cost, versus releasing funding for non-public education?

The infamous (and perpetually in the news for drugs) Rodney King said it best:

“Why can’t we all just get along?”.

Thanks Ken.

Andy

Again Andy, nice post

And yes, I’ve had to be in meetings where I personally thought the teacher, school, and entire plan were idiotic - and of course, I couldn’t open up and say that. In such meetings I’d certainly give that parent enough information and resources to become the better advocate. LD Online being one of many such resources. It would be professionally inappropriate for me to “judge” a colleague at a meeting. I could and would be sued and I would lose.

The care and treatment for children with learning disabilites in the state of Florida is abysmal. The state of the teachers of the learning disabled in Florida is mediocre at best. The treatments and strategies offered in the LD classrooms - especially secondary - in Florida is atrocious.

To do something about it, I’ve gotten very active in LDA, DLD, the International Dyslexia Association and the Council for Children with Behavior Disorders - I’m Florida’s president. I’ve put our lobbyists under the gun, telling them I know where I can get nothing a lot cheaper….and our concerns were finally addressed. I do not support all of IDEA - because certain fine print allows very dangerous children in very public situations.

Well, I have to be off to church - I wish I had longer but will try to continue this line later.