Why are some parents so afraid of LD

What

Please don’t tell me I am the only one who didn’t understand what this means?

First of all, parents wouldn’t be on this bulletin board if they were afraid of their childs LD! They would be just sitting back and watching their child fail, you won’t find any parents here who are doing that!

Second, what does getting remarried and having another child have to do with helping your children? Also, you said I was not aware that LD’s were contagious?

Sorry, but I definitely missed the point!!

K.

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not meaning to butt in here, but I will anyway…

I think what “Clark” is implying is that many parents are indeed afraid of the LD reality their children may have. I have met more than a few in my area who are in deep denial about the true extent of their children’s condition. This is very unfortunate for all parties involved and it can be very frustrating trying to help them when they refuse to acknowledge their child needs the extra attention.

The mistake “Clark” made was in not realizing that the parents on this board for the most part are not living under that condition (even as we parents make the mistake of assuming that ALL parents think like we do).

A similar thought is that the teachers/specialists/asministrators who also post on boards like this may not be attypical school personnel. Again, they are the ones who are seeking better information about sped kids so they can better service them.

I can’t help but wonder what percentage of the total populations the routine poster/lurkers on boards like these really are…

The second part of his post is simply a plea for expecting mothers to better care for themselves. It is no revelation that some LD’s are caused by problems in in utero development, which can in part be caused by improper nutrition, inadequate rest, external stress, over-exertion, etc. How much this plays into the total mix (along with genetics, blind-luck, exposure to toxins like mercury, lead, arsenic, etc) who can say?

As far as telling expectant mothers in second marriages to pack the kids off to the ex, AS IF!!! Even tho “non-traditional” families are nearing the norm, that does little to suggest what the married couple expecting their third or fourth child should do to prevent the same stress (presumedly pack off the kids to Grandma?).

I for one do not believe that we can tie the increases in specific LD’s to anything like a pregnant woman having children underfoot.

I do have a comment for Clark…

You said: I cannot understand why a LD child does not want to join an LD social group or youth group for LDer’s, because it is part of you.

Could it be possible that children with LD’s who are otherwise typical (like dyslexics or kids with ADHD) get so abused by their peers for being “retards” or “spastics” want to hide that aspect of themselves, nearly desperate for any semblance of normalcy in their lives? Is it possible that at age 12 or 14 a teen is not yet mature enough to make the decision to join a support group, but would just rather be a part of the “in-crowd”? How can a teen, in the midst of the hormonal changes ever belong to a clique and therefore find social happiness if they are meeting with the “retard club” after school two days a week?

Please don’t say they should join and not let the non-LD kids know! Word travels very, very fast along the middle school grapevine, and any who do not conform to the group standards will be bullied until they disappear. That is reality.

It is compounded by the treatment these same kids receive from adults, who should protect them from it. And before any indignant professionals chime in and say “not in my school!” let me say that the studies conducted have all ddemonstrated that LD children are the most likely targets of bullying, and that these same studies also concluded that it is more often than not permitted to continue by the adults in the schools.

It is not just teachers and principals doing this however. Many children get this from their neighbors and relatives. Sad, so very sad…

Nicely covered, Dad. As per your usual!

Sir:

You hit on the mark what I wanted to say. Yes, it is true that at 12 or 13 kids are not mature enough to want to join support groups least they be pegged as the “retard club”. Yet, the kids will soon realize that the other kids will not give them a fair shake in life… This I experienced when I was young. It used to bother me for acceptance, but now, I quit looking for the popular folks approval. The LD kids would be more effective if they joined together and defended each other from the jocks or cheerleader crowd. Moral or emotional or even physical support is good. My point about divorced families and “pack of to Grandma” this is to say, with an expectant child on the way, the last thing the mother needs to worry about is how to support some extra mouths who are not hers biologically or may have been against her marrying the father in the first place. “Why should i have to support the kids if “I am not their mother/father as they put it”. Let their real parent support them. Leave my innocent infant out of this warfare. I need rest to get a reasonably healthy baby is what the point I was trying to draw on. The other thing: I cannot believe how some parents will just believe what the school system tells them about their kid’s potential… I think they should look at their kids file and see if any derogatory evals are in it before they think the school has the kids best intrest at heart. This happened to me too. The school put alot of unfavorable remarks in my file when I did not realize it. I am still upset today. Thanks.

One of the best things I ever did was to darn-near force my 13 year old son to go on a horsepacking ten day adventure at SOAR in N.C. Their Exec. Dir. upper staff, and all counselors are L.D. All campers L.D.

It put a ton of bandages on those wounds and started the healing process that is still underway five years later. Great folks there at SOAR to help children find things to validate in themselves, even LD.

They have programs in other places, too. They go to the Keys in FL every Christmas week. Wyoming/Colorado/Maine and maybe others. Check them out:

http://www.soarnc.org

Great people with a great mission. Lifesavers almost.

Kids aren’t going to be totally mature enough to accept their LD, but we must help them down so many roads—or at least show them that the path exists.

What are you talking about? Are we to just say, Oh my daughter is LD, she is going to get either an IEP diploma or modified diploma, Oh isn’t that nice that she can’t read and won’t have a future! I’ll just get her in a nice support group for the rest of her life and she can just make a bad marriage and just live with mommy and daddy for the rest of her life……..Get real! I found what worked for my child, now she is in college doing what she wants to do and never went to a LD group. LD isn’t something that you are embarrassed about but something that you want to overcome either by strategies or remediation. We are mothers and mothers are tough in the animal kingdom and don’t try to stand in our way when we are on a mission, the misssion: finding a way for our offspring to make it in life, this is our job and our obsessive.

Hi Susan,

My son has never been to the Keys but would love to go. He is 9. The Florida Keys programs says it takes 8-18. Wonder how they managed with that wide range of kids. Also, wondered if I should wait until he is older. Any thoughts?

Beth

First, the folks at SOAR are really Mom/Dad friendly. Call them and discuss your concerns and needs. They have been doing this a long time and I do know that their ratio is very, very low—like 3:1 adult-child. Probably higher on opening day to learn routines.

I’d think about going up for a family weekend in the fall. The Smokies are georgeous. We did that one year. It really isn’t that far from you probably. It’s about a 16 hour drive from here. It is a wonderful area to visit—I enjoyed myself thoroughly.

During the summer, the younger kids do llama trekking instead of horse packing. Fun to see the pictures of the smaller ones with the llamas. You must be the judge of what course offering is best for your guy. Mine wasn’t a good and comfortable swimmer. Yours may be better. Talk to SOAR about abilities and needs.

I actually was thinking about the Key West trip because it is close to here and only a week. There are the issues of being away from home—he never has. But also I was wondering if the benefits that you found for your son would come for a child as young as mine—9.

Beth

That is true: However, can we ever make LD dissapear ? Nope ! You have to be realistic…. Even though you get the college degree, the job you get as a person with LD may be not too much better than a non Bachelor Degree holder. Also, the idea of overcoming LD through remediation and strategy works well…. this is only if you are not fresh off the boat in America with 1 suitcase and no family support. You attend school and work 2 jobs or 3 catching your sleep when you can. When you marry and if you have kids with LD. You do not have time to pressure the school to give acomodations. Anyway, accept LD and do your best in the world.

Dad is right, not many teens would join a support group. They spend all day long at school trying to make the other kids think they are normal. I guess maybe my son would be considered a double dipper, because even though he’s LD, he’s also part of the
“in crowd” and a jock.
Now about the second family thing,and I am part of one. When you marry that second time around, you have to be committed to making
those other children a part of your life. If you aren’t willing to accept those children then you shouldn’t be in that relationship. There are to many cases of shipping the first family off to make room for the second one. When you marry someone with children, those children become part of your responsiblity too.
I’m not afraid of LD, I hate it, I hate what it’s done to my son, but I’m not afraid. I think if any of us were afraid, we wouldn’t be here. We are at this BB, because we have excepted the problem and what to find ways to make it better. As far as confronting the school, you have to pick your battles, because as much as you don’t want to think it happens, sometimes when you complain, it makes it worse on the kid. You wouldn’t think professionals such as teachers would take that approach, but trust me they do.

I am sorry Clark, but you negative attitude is something that I can’t buy into. Why would you think that once you get any higher education, you would get a lesser job with it than someone with the label LD on their forehead? Actually, my daughter is having an easier time at college than her non-LD counterparts. As she says, noone cares that she has to spell and grammar check, all they care about is the finished product. She can take her time with her subject load and choose to do less subjects when she feels that she will need more time for a certain subject. She wants to be a radiation therapist and when she finished her degree, she will get the same job and the same pay than someone that isn’t LD. Actually, since she can read, use spell check and grammar check, decide how many subjects she will take at a time, (many students without LD stamped on their foreheads do the same, taking more time in college to finish is the norm rather than the acception), she is just like the non-LD students. One thing that she has over all of them is the determination to succeed due to all of the struggle just receiving a diploma. Even though she can read and comprehend her books, she perfers to learn using her strength, she is a great auditory learner. Oh, one other thing, noone at the Kent State University knows that she is LD. She felt that there was no reason to tell them. Since she can read, she feels that she isn’t LD. I don’t know of anyone that doesn’t have some problems with some subjects. If I was a student in high school right now, I would be labeled LD in math. I am sorry, but you make no sense to me in your posts.

Clark,

You are describing your life. Not the life of all people with LD. You have no idea.

I know way too many super successful people who are LD. They don’t let it define them. Ever heard of John Chambers, Walt Disney, Charles Schwab, and Albert Einstein.

Maybe you should drop them a line and tell them they are supposed to be underemployed. I don’t think they realize that they weren’t supposed to be successful.

They really should just stay with their own kind. Oh Please

I am not afraid of my daughter having dylsexia. I know things are not always easy for her, especially academically, but she is great. My nickname for her since she was a baby is My Twinkling Star. My fear is that people, ( ie. the school, those others that hold lower expectatoins for LD kids, ect) will never give her the chance to shine. THAT, I beleive is the fear that we, the parents on this BB hold close to our hearts. My daughter is young, 6 1/2, and I know she will be fine. I will see to that, making sure she gets what she needs along the way. She is a bright, sweet child who also just happens to be dyslexic. She possesses many gifts, very artistic, extremely loving and caring, very intelligent and tries very hard at the things that just escape her. LD is does not define the child, it is merely a part of them…We will work hard, but always remember the many gifts she also possesses…..

Mamm:

You talk about Einstien life as a person with LD being successful ? Did you realize he was overrated. After WW2 he made no new significant discoveries that are noted in the history books. Dr. Wehrner Von Braun the Geman Scientist who was the father of the V-2 rocket, was also LD and he after WW2 got us to the moon. The only reason his V-2 never made bigger strides was because his superiors during 1938-45 interfered with his research. As for Walt Disney, Beetoven etc. I will bet they came from affluenet backgrounds where a rich realative or someone helped their family with “living expenses” so they could concentrate on their schooling not have to do 3 jobs and raise a family. As for your assertion “You are describing your life” with LD, it is not only my life with LD. There are alot of people with LD who do not have jobs reaching their full potential because of discrimination or indifference of the school system. The software programs such as spellcheck are great tools that only came out in the mid 1990’s not previously. Also, what is wrong with being id’d as LD ? Your making it sound as if it was a scarlet letter like membership in the Gestapo. LD people need to have a bit of pride too. Who better to lead people who are LD to a better day than someone who is LD ? Higher education is okay… never said it wasn’t. All that is said is do not expect the majority of times to have a job comeserate with the degree especially with LD. This is what is meant by my statement.

True… Just have a nice smile. But a smile with steel teeth underneath used when appropriate on uncooperative school officials.

I don’t like labels. I think that they are often times counterproductive. I don’t even like special education. If special education worked, more children would exit it, but they don’t. I also think that there are way too many kids justified for services and are only doing poorly due to whole language. The two education initiatives in congress, NCLB and reevaluating IDEA, hopefully will help special education and make it more effective. I also believe that IDEA is the reason that WL has continued to flourish in the US because if a child is two years behind in reading when he reaches third grade, there must be something wrong with him, LD. Right now, sped is the only thing that kids have that may get them help. You make a lot of statements, do you have proof of kids that graduate from some post-graduate degree and don’t get a job in their field and if they do, work for a lower wage? Most employers don’t even know that a student has a sped classification unless that person tells them. Also, ‘not’ being classified anything isn’t a guarantee of a degree, a good life and a job in your chosed profession. You are in control of your life, if you have problems, you may have to work harder but a lot of people do. I don’t look at the label as a defining feature of that person. My daughter was very popular when she was in school. She didn’t have any probems with her peers accepting her, just teachers. I remember when she had birthday parties, all her friends wanted to sit beside her to help her read her cards. They didn’t define her by her label, but who she was as a person. You are making statements that should be backed up by statistics. Do you have them?

I know you are making a point, but as a mathematician with a lot of science classes under my belt, I have to tell you that you are absolutely incorrect about Einstein. He made his most important discoveries in his twenties, but continued to refine his work later on. He was an extremely successful teacher and a great humanitarian. After WWII, as you pointed out, he made no great discoveries, but he died in 1955, and was pretty ill in the few years before that.

Neither Walt Disney and Beethoven had priviledged childhoods. Disney was the son of immigrants and inherited the immigrants’ work ethic. His family was lower middle class at best. Beethoven’s father was an impoverished musician and a drunkard who beat Beethoven as a small child, made him stay up all night practicing piano, and exploited his son for cash. Besides their LD’s, what these men had in common was the pursuit of their talents, which were so great that their weaknesses in other areas were irrelevant.

As for von Braun, his participation in the Nazi regime is still very controversial. It appears that, while a gifted scientist, he would work for anyone as long as they paid him. His devotion to science was greater than his devotion to mankind, which is not true of Albert Einstein.

Your point, whatever it is, would be more valid with your “facts” checked.

Mamm:

Your point about Von Braun shows a total lack of understanding about the diffrence between a Dictatorship and a Democracy. You say Von Braun would work for anyone who paid him ? Also, his dedication to science was more than his dedication to mankind. Well, I do not know about you but if a dictator like Adolf Hitler gave me the choice of working to produce rockets for him and his plans or seeing my family evicted from my house and jailed in a filthy, dirty jail cell (no HBO) and possibly executed. I tell you I would do what was right for my survival and family. In this country we can say no. In a dictatorship we cannot. Anyway, Von Braun overcame his LD, and America got to the Moon, has possibilities to colonize Mars and won the Cold War using German technology. Now that was an investment well worth it. There has not been any volume of documents that I know of, to support the claims that Von Braun was a fanatical Nazi or had any role in running concentration camps willingly or knowingly. He was a man dedicated to exploring space and not a politician. As for Einstien, he couldn’t do his own taxes…. and he did not figure the A-bomb by himself. Some scientist….

You’ve twisted facts to validate your opinions. That is no way to prove an argument. Maybe it was von Braun who didn’t really understand the difference between a dictatorship and a democracy. People can say no in a dictatorship. Brave people do, and they often die. Dozens of my own German relatives died in the camps (who were not Jewish), because they refused to aid and abet the Nazis.

Von Braun knew that concentration camp labor was used in the developement of the V-2. He used Nazi money to fund his team of engineers. Dozens of websites verify this. His rockets bombed London and France. He fled Germany, not because of the atrocities the Nazis were committing, but because the Nazis had decided that von Braun’s visions of space travel were frivolous and a waste of money. The von Braun team surrendered to the United States because the United States had the most money to support his rocket research. While he worked for NASA after the war, he was under FBI suveillance for most of the rest of his life, and was suspected of having dealings with Kruschev. He was, in fact, a great engineer and his vision was responsible for travel to the moon. All facts. Also a fact: he failed physics and mathematics courses as a teenager, because he was working on a car.

The ironic thing about your position is that von Braun could not have envisioned space travel had not Einstein come out with his theories. Von Braun didn’t figure out rockets by himself, either. Until the theories of General and Special Relativity, and the Photoelectric Effect, physicists were still trying to figure out what was wrong with the idea of space being a “great ether”. Robert Goddard and Edwin Hubble owe much of their research to Einstein’s ideas. Both of these men’s work were key to von Braun’s accomplishments. Propulsion come to mind as a refinement to rockets that would have been impossible without Einstein.

Undoubtedly, von Braun was a great engineer and scientist. Einstein was a great scientist and a decent man. Why can’t you allow both men greatness? As far as Einstein not being able to do his taxes, that is probably a myth, but so what if it’s true? Isn’t that one of the difficulties a man with a learning disability might have?

Your arguments about Einstein would have been more valid had you attacked him personally. Einstein was a great humanitarian on a global level, but was a lousy husband and father.

Einstien’s role as a father is of no intrest to me. I however cannot farthom why some people would rather starve on so called principles than just get along and change the system non-violently. After all what good is it to resist and be killed ? Your of no use in the incenerator burnt to ashes. Anyway, von braun was intrested in reaching the moon not using space for military purposes. You blamming Von Braun for sacrificing noble principles to work on the German Rocket program for the SS…It’s like blaming scientists who work on the nuclear programs in America as being part of a killing machine. Are they also wiling to work for whomever pays them the highest wage ? There is no diffrence with Von Braun wanting to feed his family and just stay out of politics just as these scientists are doing so.

You’re missing my point. Just forget it. You are cheating yourself when you distort the facts to suit your purposes. You aren’t even understanding what I’m saying.

Can we stop this thread? This has nothing to do with LD kids today and it is getting ridiculous.