They won't be kids forever.

Lots of truth woven with toxin here as well Ball. I’m ld, I’m adult, and I’m making a pretty darned good living as well in the real world. My ld issues actually enhance my abilities to perform in an industry where there is much chaos. I wouldn’t be quite so quick to write off all ld’ers as failures and losers. Couldn’t really hack school, dropped out of college quickly… With regards to parental involvement, you are absolutely correct, get involved, don’t be intimidated, stay on top of what is going on in your child’s classroom(s) and school(s). The ld doesn’t typically go away, mine sure hasn’t; but I sure don’t feel “screwed”. That may be part of the blessing of ld, even if I am “screwed”, I am unaware of it, and therefore it has no impact on me. Parental involvement and attitude are of incredible importance, and learning that there is life beyond the ld impacted circle in school is there for the living; it’s there for the harvest for those who want it. It’s not what happens that’s critical, it’s how you respond to what has happened that dictates where you will go and what you will do.

Andy

Andy my friend,from one LD adult to another, I couldn’t have said it better:-)

My son is the only LD one on either side of our family. You two are my models for LD adults. You guys give me great hope that we will get through school and my son will become a productive, contributing member of society. I see the strength you have because of what you have dealt with yourselves and with your kids. I can only hope the same for my son.

Beth

Andy,

Well the it seems for all intents and puroses as far as your job is concerned you are NOT disabled. Yeah and Churchill was dyslexic and Beethoven was deaf. They and you are the exception not the rule. For most of us this LD thing is a lifelong struggle. I’m glad you are successful and I,m glad Stevie Wonder is successfull too. Wonder is not really Stevie’s last name. Just “WONDERING” where he’d be today if he was “LD”. Also WONDERING where he would be if he recieved no accommodation. The truth may be biiter but do not confuse medicine with poison.

While remediating my child’s LD’s is a huge priority to our family, keeping her heart safe, nurtured, and encouraged is way up there on my list too. I am hoping to avoid the bitterness and the anger that I read in your posts Ball. I do not believe, I can not allow myself to beleive, that children with LD will grow up to be minimally functioning “losers.” I choose to beleive that anything is possible and the sky is the limit. My child has gifts that none of the rest of us have and we build upon those. Hopefully someday this child of mine will grow up to be whatever it is that she desires. I hope that you also find a *fulfilling* path to travel.

I believe that alot of Ball says is true. The attitude that Ball has pushes peoples buttons and they can’t get past that.

This is what I heard Ball say:
Well we all know that there are a lot of toxic schools and the responsibility for reforming them lies with the parents and the school board
Change takes time. Reform of public schools is very possible.
Taking a proactive approach is the only way.
This will be a lifelong struggle for “Johnny” and for you if you decide to stay in the fight.
Parental involvment is the only way to keep schools from becomming toxic

A parent cannot possibly know how their LD child feels during his entire school day and cannot possible know everything that child endures on a daily basis. A parent cannot possibly know how much emotional damage their LD child will receive by the time they think about entering college and cannot possibly know if their child will have resilience.

I agree with Ball, we need to get organized and get our butts to the board meetings.

I agree that there are a lot of toxic schools, and that parents should be actively involved in reforming them. I also agree that true self-esteem is built on solid achievement, and that LD does not magically go away. That takes time and work. It took vast amounts of one-on-one, together with several high-dollar specialized programs, a minimum of three hours a day on top of regular school and homework, seven days a week, over five years to take my CAPD, CVPD, ADD, sleep-apneic child to the point at which she could function well in a top preparatory school without supports of any kind.

–-This will be a lifelong struggle for “Johnny” and for you if you decide to stay in the fight.

I don’t think it needs to be a lifelong struggle for most kids. Once I had a clear idea of what I was dealing with, I figured that it was like a diagnosis of childhood leukemia; Just about 100% lethal without treatment; better than 95% survival rate with treatment; five truly crummy years while we fought the illness; but after that, all the good years yet to live. Six years later I see no reason to change my feelings about it.

–-If you think your school is bad, wait untill Johnny has dealings with the virulent slime at your state’s OVR.

I agree that school guidance counsellors are poorly equipped to counsel people who are in nonacademic tracks. Five years or so ago, when I wasn’t sure how far my kid would be able to go, I looked into potential nonacademic careers for her. Wow! Some of them, like commercial divers, make a whole lot more money than most professionals, and appear to have a lot more fun. It is a pity that schools do such a poor job on vocational counselling.

–Parental involvment is the only way to keep schools from becomming toxic. Some schools are probably too far gone to be rehabittated. Columbine was a good example. As tragic as that was it was a wake up call to all punks and bullies and disinterested principals and school superintendants.

I really don’t see the gunmen as having been justified in any way for what they did.

Andy,

Thank you, we need your voice around here. Problems in school do not translate into problems in life. I actually know many who did well in school and not as well as others with LD in the real world. LD doesn’t stand for Life disability. It is just a small part of the complete picture. Parents have the ability to change the outcome for their children.
I really think parents need to hear this. It can be scary and frustrating at times. It helps to see the big picture.

Linda

Who knows what the future will bring but if the present is any indication the future for “LDers” appears to be bleak. So Pollianna, you don’t like anger. Anger beats apathy any day of the week. Take off the rose colored glasses and smell the coffee. Did you know that 80% of all inmates identify themselves as LD? Also did you know that many inmates were Ritalin junkies as children.

Lets see how you feel 10 years down the road when after graduating from a suck college with a worthless degree. In the real world her gifts won’t mean jack. Employers care abot one thing and one thing only and that is profit. Productivity means profit.

There’s a series of paintings by Thomas Cole called the voyage of life. In it a child is in a boat on a gentle river being piloted by an angel. In the second the angel departs and turns the rudder over to a very young man as the river remains gentle. In the third frame the river is raging and the rudder is broken. The last frame is a frightened old man heading off with the angel towards heaven.

If Thomas Cole had painted it from the LD point of it would be a man up @!#$ creek without a paddle ina leaky boat and the angels would be urinating on him. I know it sucks but that is reality!!

Ah someone sees the light. As for the rest if you perhaps it would be best to remain in the dark.

As far as justifying Columbine it’s not a matter of that.The point is people will only take so much crap before they snap. The abuse that the Columbine shooters suffered is the same kind of opression that prompts the good old U. S. of A to drop bombs.

Ball,

I’m a construction superintendent. I have worked my way up to where I am at this point, and my ld issues pop up and glare their ugly little faces periodically. My handwriting is almost illegible. I have had trouble with some letters not wanting to be written as they should, and even when I look at them, I know I am writing them incorrectly, yet in my conscience mind I cannot fix what I need to, as my hand (motor skill) will nto cooperate. Yet I keep daily log book that for the most part only I can read, and even I have trouble sometimes. I have adapted to using a digital camera and documenting what happens at different stages, when there are problems etc., and tracking what goes on. I have to deal with 2 cell phones, job phones and multiple contractors at multiple job sites on a daily basis. This does not exclude my employer and his tyranical issues that can sometimes pop up at any given moment as well. I am fluent in spanish, can hold multiple conversations with various trades all within a short period of time and my ability to maintain good attention to small details has been of imeasurable help. I tell you all this not to boast, but to point out that some of the ld issues I have (like add, not hyperactive) has it’s advantages. Many of my peers in the industry are angry, hostile, power mad alcoholics. I have a blast most days, I enjoy what I do and the confusion is fun for the most part for me. I tried working in an office situation for a few months and I was going insane during that period of my employement. Having the writing issues has sharpened my memory over the years. Typing has been a Godsend, which I do when ever possible. My boss and most others tease me about my writing, I have built up quite a thick skin as you see, it’s similar teasing to what was so hard to deal with during school years. It helped me explain to our son that this still goes on and he needed to learn to not be quite so sensitive. He laughed when I showed him my log book, but when I need to go back and pull something up from a date way back when, I can usually decipher what needed to be documented, and most who question what went on back off when they see I track things like I do. You see Ball, I CHOOSE TO NOT LET MY LD ISSUES LIMIT MY ABILITY TO DO WHAT I AM GOOD AT, what I have learned to be good at, and for all intents and purposes, what I make a reasonable living at.

I challenge the concept of success, as though it is defined by how much money one makes. I only hope I have taught my son and others who I mentor (or nag) that true success is finding what you enjoy doing and making a living at it. Any living. I believe one will adapt thier lifestyle to match the income, or they will find a way to survive. Success is so much about enjoying what it is you do, not seeing how much money one can make. I work for someone who defines it all by the all mighty dollar. I see it as being a bottomless pit that can never be filled, he is never really happy or content with what goes on… there must always be more. I don’t know, it’s just my opinion, however, I do know I sleep real well at night, every night and that’s a priceless comodity.

The truth can be bitter, it can also be freedom. Much of what the outcome is of circumstances is how one deals with, and/or responds to what has happened. Wealthy people can be miserable. Poverty sticken individuals can have the peace we all seek. People with vision can be far more limited than a blind person. The funny irony about life is everyone has problems, being able to put a label on it sometimes helps us understand what’s going on, but it’s up to the individual, once they reach adulthood, to work with the cards they’ve been dealt. It’s real easy to fall victim to the negativity and then battle with every hurdle that life dumps in one’s path. Learning to choose the battles wisely and maintain a level head when the sh*t is flying have been lessons learned the hard way, and a school of progress (not without setbacks).

Wow, What an awesome testimony!! Thanks for sharing that and I totally agree with you. Success is not or should not be measured by how much money one makes. If a person is priveldged to make a living doing what they love and they live a peaceful life filled with people who they love and love them back, I don’t think you can find much more success than that.

Again, thank you for your refreshing take on life, work, and learning differences.

I guess I don’t beleive that her gifts won’t mean “jack.” We live in an area where people make their livings doing many different, non-traditional, things….pottery, painting, writing, illustrating books, graphic design from their homes, creating landscape designs, etc. The world is open to my dd and she can pursue anything she wants and she will have our support and her own self confidence to make it happen.

BTW, she isn’t in traditional school. We are hoping to bypass a lot of the “YUK” that goes on there for kids who learn differently and preserve her sense of self, her individuality, her power as a person to achieve and be whoever she wants to be.

I do have to say here, and I don’t mean this antagonistically, but I do hope that you can find some peace in your life. Some sense of well being, as your posts drip with bitterness and anger and disllusionment that life has not turned out the way you wanted. Maybe *you* need to take charge and make the changes necessary to your own life to bring about some peace for yourself.

Glad to get the point out there. I have come a long way from the battle grounds with our toxic school district, fighting at every turn. I still see guys who knew me when we were in the thick of things from mediation to due process to the federal court proceedings. My ld issues during those times were both a blessing and a curse. Funny thing is now, I have friends who years later have children, some with ld issues. They ask me about stuff, I can tell them pretty straight and from personal experience. I even think I’ve been able to get thru to a few to understand that it’s the wiring in thier kids heads that’s possibly askew… not a defiant or “dumb” child. Anyway, it’s been a long row to hoe ;)

So are you saying that you had to go through mediation and “federal” court proceedings to get your LD’s addressed in a school setting? YIKES!!!

looooooooooooooooooooooong story. danced with our district thru the entire process for over 6 years for our son. We removed him prior to starting the battle and ultimately lost in the proceedings. We did not lose our son, so the outcome was still for the best, just tough to swallow at times.

When you have time can you post your story? Or if you have already shared it can you direct me to the posts in the archives? When you removed your son where did you place him? What are his learning issues? Do you mind me asking? My dd is 10 and profoundly dyslexic. We are home schooling her and using a private tutor a few times a week that works with her and teaches me how to teach her on the days she doesn’t go to the tutor. It is very labor intensive and sometimes I wonder if we are on the right track. I hope so……the one thing I am certain of is that we have preserved her self worth which can be a huge part of the battle.

Annette,

Sorry to be so quick, but it’s early and I couldn’t tell you how to go back to the archives anyway. Here’s a letter of our saga, which I’ve posted on various occassions before, but it gives you an idea of where we’ve been. Remember, it’s a while ago, our son is now 20.

Andy
––––––––––-

Attn: LDA, State of CA
GRAM PUBLICATION OPEN LETTER TO PARENTS

Re: What was learned from the nightmare of a Learning Disabled Parent of a Learning Disabled Child attempt to obtain a FAPE in our local district.

To Whom It May Concern:

First, I ask your patience, because I, like my son, have a learning disability. I have difficulty with handwriting, so I always type. Typing makes the words legible, spell check makes the paper presentable, however, unfortunately, they have yet to invent the program to unscramble the word processing of a dyslexic mind.

Anyone who has lived through / survived the hellish experience of help seeking within the public school system for a child will know that this letter has the capacity for a 1000 page novel; I will do my best to be brief.

Our son was diagnosed with “LD” by the public school Psychologist in the 1st Grade. He was given an IEP, which was to begin his 2nd Grade year. By the 3rd Grade, with minimal and no provision of the services specified on his IEP, our son was floundering terribly. His areas of deficit were dysgraphia, dyslexia and other assorted invisible disorders, which clearly affected his performance in school.

By the second month of his 4th Grade year, having no RSP (as specified on his IEP), and no Counseling (as specified on his IEP), our son tried to slam his head through a window at home. He told us, with tears streaming down his face that he would rather die than go back to school, “where the teachers did not understand, and the kids were so mean about this handwriting”. He was 9 years old.

My wife and I sought help from the school; and the rest is documented history. Of course, it is also documented that the school claimed he was doing fine in class, the problems were coming from the home.

We (my wife and I) attended countless IEP Meetings (with and without advocates), we have attended Mediation Conferences (with and without advocates), I have represented my son in State level Due Process Hearings, and I have represented our son, alone, in Federal Court.

I know what it is like to be a learning disabled parent, seeking protection for our learning disabled son from a system that allows a school district to hire the representation of a “consultant” whose sole purpose is to keep the district from providing those services which are due the child by law. (I could go on and on about this one extremely unfair practice that is tolerated, the fact is, everyone knows this happens, and the child is still left without help, unless the parents can afford the services of costly consultants or attorneys).

I know what it is like to have an inexperienced advocate intervene and represent our son at Due Process Hearing, and have to sit back and watch an absolute kangaroo court in progress, while the Dean of the McGeorge School of Law presided.

Perhaps I need to digress for a moment and explain that during this time I was working, and unemployed at times, in the construction industry here in Southern California. It is common knowledge in the business world for sub-contractors to be loyal to the general contractor; the reason is simple, future contracts mean more guaranteed income. Even in the blue-collar world of construction, it would be abundantly clear that if the “inspector” worked for the General Contractor, the quality of homes could be jeopardized by the “partial” decisions made by a biased inspector. How obvious must it be for a law school like McGeorge School of Law to be a contractor with the State Department of Education to side in behalf of school districts whenever possible?

In June of 1991 McGeorge’s Year to Date Statistics show that the total number of Due Process Hearing Decisions rendered, parents did not obtain the services they fought for in Due Process 70% of the time!

If the hearing Officer finds the district to be within compliance, then the State does not have to enforce any “laws”, because there was no violation! This is absolutely ludicrous. The burden is entirely on the parent, and the power is entirely in the system.

I speak from experience. I will gladly provide a list of all the names and numbers of “protective agencies”, government employees, political figures etc., who were well aware of our son’s predicament. This is not limited to, but includes Chief Liaison to President Clinton, the Federal Dept. of Ed, State Dept. of Ed., Protection and Advocacy, the Governor’s Office, Congressmen, Assemblypersons, Senators, local agencies, OSEPS, OSERS, Office for Civil Rights (the list is endless)… The bottom line is there is no help, only a terribly tangled web of beaurocracy the feeds off of our taxes, and is simply impotent, inept and incapable of enforcing the laws that were written to protect children. The blatant and total failures of these public officials to enforce protections is disappoint, to say the least; corruption of this magnitude would not go on, if it were not tolerated at the higher levels.

I have scores of letters I sent to attorneys and agencies (and their responses) from across the country, begging for help for our son. My only request was to either enforce the law and provide him the FAPE he required, or release him from the system, and provide us with the funding to ensure he be educated and not destroyed.

One of LDA-CA’s past presidents, Joan Esposito, had written a GRAM which clearly outlined the problems parents like us have experienced. She is one of the only ones who understood the frustrations of what we were going through. (I can only imagine that she has an entire file cabinet with our son’s name on it!) I continue to thank God for her strength and compassion for our kids. The gauntlet is excruciating, the retaliatory actions of a school district are disgusting, and designed to exhaust parents. Our son’s last “active IEP” was his 4th Grade IEP, which was never enforced. He is currently going into the 10th Grade!

After 6 years of attempting to “right the wrong”, and taking both the local school district and the state dept. of Ed “to task”, I have only learned that I could do the impossible for our son. That was to survive the stress of war, stay married to his mother, see that he finally get an appropriate education (outside of the system), and move on with our life.

I have since passed on my “law library”, a virtual war chest of cases, laws and protections for learning disabled children to a local (San Diego) advocate. She has my permission to copy and pass along any and all data I compiled; including phone numbers, addresses etc. My hope and prayer is some other parents may get the help our son never received. It was quite a paradox to find all the protections, and rights our child had, yet been completely incapable of finding any authority to enforce the law!

My wife and I went to a leading “special education attorney and we begged for her to help; she felt to “untangle this case at this stage” it would cost an estimated $70,000.00, at least. It might as well have been $70,000,000.00, if you can imagine the devastating news to hear such a proposal. The up front money was to be a minimum of $15,000.00. I don’t know about anyone reading this letter, but that is a substantial amount of money which we did not / do not have! It is probably noteworthy to mention that there are not very many lawyers who specialize in the highly complex field of special education law; and those that do, usually work for school districts and the states, those that don’t are extremely expensive!

Out of necessity for our son, I virtually became the closest anyone will probably come to being a lay-lawyer in the highly specialized field of Special Education Law. For over 2 years, I stood alone, as a parent, in Federal Court, without an attorney, and did the best I could. With my wife’s help, we won some Motions, lost a few, and even had Court Decisions OVERTURNED, without help from attorneys! Truly, I will admit that the damage and suffering of such battles was more psychological and detrimental to peaceful family existence, and the fall out was financial, emotional destruction. It was as close to divorce and stress that I will ever hope to experience for the rest of my life.

Ultimately, the Federal Court Judge Ordered me to find an attorney for our son, because, if I did not, he said that our son’s case would lose at the Appeals level, due to the child not being properly represented in Court. What an irony, even if we could have won at the first level, they would have had it overturned because of how he was represented. Again, after an exhaustive search, we finally located a young, fresh out of Law School attorney, who offered to represent our son “pro bono”. Remember, we had been in Federal Court for over a year prior to her having even graduated from Law School! Within 3 months, our son’s case was closed, and the State Dept. of Ed and the local school district were absolved of any responsibilities.

I believe it is important that you understand the following, which is of public record in the Federal Court system in Southern California:

1. The District admitted to not providing services on our son’s IEPs.
2. The District could not provide original copies of documents where my name was added to agreements. (Reviewed by a documents fraud examiner).
3. The District failed to properly diagnose our son’s disabilities.
4. The District contracted a Dr. (for $14,000.00, on record)) to diagnose our son during the pending court case, to determine “what would have been appropriate 3 years past; when this same district had tested him 7 times within 12 months during the time in question.
5. State level investigations were useless.
6. OCR findings were biased and inaccurate.
7. McGeorge School of Law hearing transcripts are of record, and the Hearing Officer’s failure to acknowledge or address blatant violations of Special Ed Laws are abundant.
8. Numerous other violations of Education Law were proven clearly on Court Records.
9. Our son NEVER had another “active” IEP from the time when we filed for Due Process; the two parties (parents and district) could never come to agreement, so…

Our son’s case ended over a year ago. The scars my wife and I carry may never go away. Time is the healer and seeing our son doing well as a soon to be 10th Grader is the soothing ointment to assure us we did the right thing. He has no IEP, he gets no special help, and he is working very hard. He is alive, healthy and we are grateful. We stood by our child and did what we thought we had to do, protect him at all cost.

Adding insult to injury, after the case was closed, we received legal documents from the school district’s attorneys’, attempting to bill us for the legal costs they incurred! Some of these costs included the depositions they took of our son’s “expert witnesses”, a document fraud examiner and a Neuropsychologist; both who are highly qualified specialists. These testimonies clearly demonstrate among other issues the district’s blatant failures to diagnose our son’s disabilities, their (district’s) inability to explain how my signature ended up on a copy of an education contract that I had refused to sign. The irony is the district DID NOT enter these depositions as evidence after their attorneys deposed these witnesses, I DID!

My advice to anyone who will listen. If you are an advocate, thank you for your strength, courage and perseverance, and for trying to help protect our children. To you parents, until there are drastic changes in how the laws are enforced, do what you have to do to save your child. Our experience dictates that it might be wiser to pull your child and put him/her in a safe non-public environment as soon as possible. The money will be more effectively spent there, and less stress placed upon your family.

You see, for those of us who do not have a lot of money, we need to determine where best to spend the limited resources we have on what we find to be most precious to us, our kids. Moreover, for those who have enough money for attorneys and consultants why would they spend it on fighting a system? They can afford the tutoring, counselors, private educations…

Absolute power corrupts, and all the laws in the world are useless, until they are enforced. God bless you Joan, Mary Ann, Chris, Sandy, Adele (retired), and the rest of you advocates who fight for our kids!

Sincerely,

Andy

Ps/ Everything we experienced is of public record; I wish (pray) to God somebody had the time, money and courage to look at what clearly was the “Anatomy of a Public School’s Failure”. What has happened to my family, and specifically to our child, is the story of one; however, it will clearly show what happens to all who get involved and try to help a child (anyone’s child).

WOW!!!!! Oh my gosh! I can’t imagine going through all of that. First of all I admire that a dad got so involved. That in itself is awesome! My dh is a wonderful person, good provider, loves our children with everything in him, but leaves the advocating to me and it is a lot to carry alone. I think the whole thing is so overwhelming he just doesn’t know where to begin.

When you removed your son from ps where did you place him? How did he end up getting to a place of being able to function in a school setting without any services? And what is he doing now at 20 years old? If I am asking anything you don’t want to answer I understand.

We started seeking help with the public schools. During my dd’s first grade year, she was in a small private school with a wonderful teacher. She was not progressing and not able to manage the work at all. She couldn’t remember the ABC’s, her phone number, etc. I knew something was up. She is my third of 4 kids and I knew something was very different here. Anyway, the ps took *forever*. They lost her file, rescheduled appointments constantly, planned apointments weeks apart from each other, we had a SLP who informed me when she called to schedule our appointment, that she was going through a very diffiuclt, traumatic, divorce and had only been at work sporadically. I was horrified. This emotionally wiped out woman was going to take my wonderful, bright, daughter and try to determine if she had learning issues and then make a reccomendation? Her office was stifling hot and reeked of cigarette smoke as did she. It wasn’t a good situation. My heart went out o her, but geeezzz.
This whole process, from start to finish, took 7 months. They were totally out of compliance but I didn’t know that at the time. They tested her and tested her and in the end all that they could come up with was that they didn’t know why she was struggling so much. We had wasted 7 months of her 1st grade year. I had heard horror stories of the way special ed was handled so we made a choice to go it alone. Very scary! In essence we were choosing to take full responsibility for her education and to remediate her learning issues ourselves. Were we crazy??!! lol I don’t know…but I do know that we didn’t have the time (or the energy) to waste fighting a no win siutation.
We began to home school her. (We weren’t new to home schooling btw. Our older kids (no LD) had also been home schooled too but had moved onto middle school and high school. ) We went through the private sector and have continued to do so. I have made some expensive mistakes due to lack of knowledge on my part in seeking help from insititutions whose methods were ineffective for our dd. I have learned so much through this long, laborious, process.

As we stand now she sees a Linda Mood Bell tutor 2X a week (3X a week during the summer) and I work with her the other 3 days using the tutor’s instructions. I am at the point of accepting that she will need tools, such as tape recording lectures when she does eventually go to school, lap top computers, we just ordered a speaking dictionary for her. So far we have not had any involvement with the special ed department in the charter school that we home school through as I make all of the accomodations that she needs. However, before she ever goes to regular school, she will need to have an IEP in place so I am considering seeking that out this year or next.

Personally, I feel that she isn’t a good school fit…kind of a round peg fitting into a square hole. She will have to eventually make the decison for herself to see if its worth it to her to make it work. She plays tons of team sports (which is the draw of school,) is an incredible artist, and a very sweet, kind, person. We also would consider private school again….actually that would be my preference over public school.

She is 10 years old now and we live in Northern CA.

Thanks for sharing your story. Absolutely incredible. I am going to send it to my husband at work if you dont mind.

Geez,sorry I missed all this fun:-) I do have to say,regardless how I feel about Ball,and believe it or not I like the guy,or girl:-)The message in it’s original state was quite impulsive,which by the way Ball,I swear your ADHD!( I know I have already asked,and you have already said no,so I will get back on task)
I do want to comment,I hope you don’t take offensive,this is what you want,input and discussion right? I too am LD,yes,I can pretty much bet on what my kids went through and what other LD kids are going through and where other LDers are right now.

Well we all know that there are a lot of toxic schools and the responsibility for reforming them lies with the parents and the school board. So stop whining

Stop whinning? Gee will you look at that,Ball telling us to stop whinning? Can you stop whinning about VR?can you even see the word with out pissing and moaning,to coin a phrase:-) Dude,I hate to say this,but guess what? I actually know people who have had a good experience from Voc rehab. Yes,I know you don’t want to hear that,but it is true. One of those people happened to be my mother. And no it wasn’t many moons ago,she was 61 when she accessed them. Obviously it depends on what state you live. She was a survivor of neurosurgery gone way bad. (Tried to get rid of the seizures,that caused twitches). Left her aphasic,and deaf in one ear. She was a high tech nurse who could no longer do her job,because her fingers were numb,therefore she couldn’t feel a vein to start an IV,she couldn’t hear someone call her on her left side,AND she had a Gtube to feed herself ,because otherwise she might choke if she tried to eat by mouth. (Aphasia is numbness to one’s throat and or vocal cords if your wondering)
Well voc rehab really helped her out. She went back to school,yes at 61! And by the way she graduated nursing school at 40! I inheredited dyslexia from her,if your also wondering if she was LD.She was working on a degree in social service,but she died before she graduated. She wrote a paper that her professor felt was so prolific,not because of the grammar,but because it was
about her life, a little girl,poverty stricken,living in Alabama in the 60’s.He published that article in a neighborhood paper,thrilled my mom to no end.At 61,my dear Ball,this dyslexic,was published.

about how much tour school sucks and get your butts to school board meetings. Contact the commisioner of education in your state. ORGANIZE!!

Organized? This from the guy who once said,just pound them one,kick their A**,if I remember correctly. Let’s admit coming to this board actually helps one to GET ORGANIZED….

So, when “LD” Johnny goes off to college if he even can he will be screwed. If he is lucky enough to go to a school that accommodates his needs and graduates, good luck to him in the work force. Do you think his “LD” is going to magically go away? It may get worse! Do you think that his self esteem will improve when he goes to his 10th class reunion and he is woefully under employed and his former school mates are doing great.

Ball honey,there are a lot of us out there,you are NOT the only LD person,and guess what? It is possible,that there are also a lot of lders out there happy and successful? Yup,good old socks the dumbest of the dumb,couldn’t read until she was 13,recieved the humanitarian award at her 10 year class reunion. Not because of finally learning to read,( no one cared a less whether I could read or not) but because of the work I do.

So do what you all are doing now. Piss and moan. Continue the defeatest apathetic approach while little or no regard is given to your offspring or his problem. The bottom line in the real world is, how much money can you make for me? LD people are less productive therefore less desirable to employers.

Again the piss and moan,coming from the pisser and moaner. Yeah,let’s just get pissed and show them how much anger will get us.Little or no regard for our offspring? why would any of us take the time to come to this board at all if we had no regard for our offspring?That is just weird bud. The real world is about how much money can you make me,the real world is about surviving in what ever capacity we CHOOSE. Less productive? Speak for YOURSELF. I have been known to be overlyproductive. Most lders learn to keep at it,to never give up,this in theory, will always be more productive.

Change takes time. Reform of public schools is very possible. For instance, my sister’s son goes to a school in Maine and he is treated very well unlike Catholic school kindergarten he attended in Connecticut.Taking a proactive approach is the only way. So if good schools exist then all schools can be good.

I too HAVE to believe that reform is possible. What happens when your sister’s son starts having trouble? What then? Go to another school? Fight for your nephews rights? Kick the principals A**,intimidate the educators? A proactive approach is what exactly Ball?

This will be a lifelong struggle for “Johnny” and for you if you decide to stay in the fight. If you think your school is bad, wait untill Johnny has dealings with the virulent slime at your state’s OVR.

Oh ho,here comes OVR again. Poor pisser and moaner. File a freakin OCR already. If you got a case,then make the complaint work. It CAN be done! I done it twice.

Parental involvment is the only way to keep schools from becomming toxic. Some schools are probably too far gone to be rehabittated. Columbine was a good example. As tragic as that was it was a wake up call to all punks and bullies and disinterested principals and school superintendants.

Now Parental involvement,I can agree with this,too bad you spewed forth all the other BS to get to this. Ahh,yes,some schools are far too gone,again I can agree,hmm columbine,a wake up call? Can’t go there,don’t agree,but then again I don’t live in your reality either. Peace.

Well said Socks.

first we homeschooled till things calmed down. Then worked out an arangement at an expensive school for ld children. Round trip was 50 miles for my wife to drive 2 times per day and I negotiated an agreement to do work at the school (paint, landscape clearing etc…) to work off debt… Then when I simply couldn’t go back and beg for a 3rd year, we put him in a very small parochial school, a virtual 2 room school house for 7th & 8th grades. 9th-12th he went to a small parochial high school. Small classes, teacher involvement and our son’s one desire to prove he could “do it” finally led us to slowly releasing our white knuckled grip and watch what happened. There was a little floundering, but for the most part he did very well, decent enough grades, turned in all school work and graduated on time. He is now attending local Jr. College, 2nd year, working about 32 hours a week at the same job for quite a while and doing very well. He marched himself in to get tested for ld at the college and after testing he told us he thought he did so well he wasn’t going to qualify. Funny thing was the report came back with the same areas of deficit that we saw in the 3rd grade…hmmmmmmmmm.

He has access to help at school, I don’t know how much he uses, except to study and use the computer lab when he wants to.

Sports and friends was and is a big draw for him both at school and socially. I don’t mind answering any questions, nothing to hide or shy away from. Normal life stuff happens here, he’s 20, he knows everything these days, we are old fashioned and conservative… I thank him for the compliment :) Anyway, glad to give you insight and a view from a possible future; it’s not always grim (even though it hasn’t been easy, and it ain’t over yet either, I know).

Take care,
Andy

Yes, Socks. Thank you for being you. You deserve that award and so much more.