Thoughts please-long sorry

You and your son are VERY inspirational! If it was me, I would ask for a complete eval. including IQ, if only to qualify him for accomodations on the PSAT and SAT tests for college.

I agree, if he hasn’t had a full eval since 4th grade, it is long overdue!

Congratulations to your son for working so hard and doing so well!! Sometimes children get so discouraged that when they start high school, they immidiately become overwhelmed, good for him (and you) for advocating for his needs and seeking out help and guidance!!

Good Luck!

K.

Lisa,

I think my view is very different from many. I really am working very hard with my son in the hopes that he will be able to be removed from sped completely. I have a friend who has accomplished this with her son thanks to her hard work in helping him to overcome his LD through various therapies.

I think that kids who are labeled LD are stigmitized. I think such stigmas can but don’t always affect you in adult hood. I have always treated the whole LD thing with my son as something he can and will overcome. I don’t see it as a life long crippling condition. I meet so many out there who see it that way and it makes me sad.

I have two very good friends with LD.

One very bright girl mentions how demoralizing it was to be put in with children with very severe deficits. She used to look in the mirror and say, “You are so stupid.” I can see the pain in her face when discussing LD. Her parents sent her for a million IQ tests but she didn’t get real help until college. A neurologist taught here how to compensate for her memory deficit. With this she was able to get a masters degree.

I have another friend who had super parents. The moved heaven and earth to find every therapy that would help her. She suffered from motor issues but when she got to high school managed to be a star on the high school tennis team She is not someone who walks around saying, “Hi, I am LD.” When she does discuss the problems she had in childhood she emphasizes what great supportive parents she had and that she was always told she would succeed. She did!

My point in all of this is to say, “Allow your child to move on if he is ready, only you can decide if he is truely ready.” You are a super parent like my second friend’s parents. Be proud, tell him he can do it even if it means working hard. Learning to understand the meaning of hard work isn’t neccessarily a bad skill to have in life.

Lisa,

I also think you should go for the re-evaluation. You can get accommodations for SAT/PSAT with either a 504 or a IEP but usually it needs to based on a recent assessment I don’t know what that time frame is but it must be at least within three years.

I would take a look at the accommodations and determine how much extra work is your son having to do because he does not have an accommodation .Involve your son in the process of looking over the accommodations and determining there value. I think a copy of notes would be a no-brainer to implement. Your son is doing great but does he have time for other activities beside school. Some of the accommodatioms should free him up for other activities.

I disagree with Linda about the stigma associated with LD at least where I live. I would not be too quick to take a child off an IEP because it gives you a larger safety net then a 504. My older son went off of an IEP in 6th grade and ended up back on one in 10th grade.

Helen

I think you need to have had an evaluation within the last three years to qualify for accomodations on SAT ect testing. So you might want to do it for that reason only.

You also might consider insisting on copies of notes if his notes are incomplete. This is done even in college. Depending on whether you think this is a developing skill or not, he could continue to take notes, but just fill in from teacher’s. If you think he isn’t getting content adequately because of note taking, I would have him rely on someone else’s notes and just listen.

Beth

make things clearer for you-Id recommend it

I had to decide this with my 5th grader this month-Im keeping services-but it was a tough decision. And I know it will not get any easier

I do think teachers who see these kids doing well dont always realize what mom/family is putting in to get them there-and we cant go to college with them!!!!

Not to mention siblings-my other two dont have any learning issues and have commented how gypped they feel-my middle guy actually went through a stage where he faked having math problems to get attention. It DOES affect the whole family

I know always something else to consider! Are you very sure that if he was reevaluated that he would meet the criteria for an IEP? This is something I would seriously consider. He might, no longer according to definition, be LD and able to obtain services at all. Don’t want you to shoot yourself in the foot here.
Now with that being said,is there any goals written on his IEP? You mention accomodations,which is what a 504 plan would be,but you don’t mention goals and objectives.

Have you discussed accomodations with your son? I mean have you fully explained what these accomodations are? What the laws say he deserves to have and why? If he fully understands the reasons for accomodations,if he still doesn’t want to access them,then I frankly don’t see where your gonna change this kids mind about using them.Whether it is a 504 or and IEP,if he won’t use them then he won’t use them.

If he is accessing help before and after school and this is the way he wants to do it,I say,you go BOY! One thing I will say about being ld myself( and then I won’t say anymore,because you all know how I feel) is when it was something I truely wanted to do or learn,superhuman effort was applied. I am this way to this day:-)
But do NOT kid yourself Lisa,these teacher’s know exactly how much help and support your son is getting at home.It IS a team effort. And MANY kids recieve no support or help, LD or no LD.

Let me start by thanking you all for such wonderful responses and being so supportive. I will try and address everyones thoughts concerns. 1st off yes I think it would be nice if he no longer qualified needed services. This child has worked so hard to come as far as he has. I am also realistic in I see his struggles. He has great difficulty taking notes at the pace the teacher gives lectures, he has trouble copying from the board quick enough to get it all, lets say spelling well we wont get into that, reading although is improving is still very slow and labored. He works very hard for his grades. It can take him up to 1 1/2 hours to do 1 hand out. Socks, I am pretty sure he would still qualify because his oral language skills are still behind (difficulty asking questions-makes statements instead), like I said his reading is very slow and labored according to his tutor he does not use word attack skills. He chooses not to use his accomodations because he does not want the other kids to think he is stupid. His greatest strength is his perserverence, he always picks himself backup and just keeps going. He sets very high goals for himself and don’t take no for an answer. His only goals have more to do with his ADD. They are complete and turn assignments in 80 percent of the time, ask for help when needed, use his planner, study for tests. His note taking skills I do believe are an emerging skill. This is my dilema dont want to discourage this new developing skill but how can you pass a test with only 50 percent of the notes? His resource teacher made 2 very disturbing comments which makes me believe private tutoring will have to address his remaining problems. She said he will NEVAER learn to spell and his reading skills may always be “depressed”. This is what got me thinking about what they might do.

Tell the teacher’s to wait and keep their thoughts to themselves. No one knows what is in store for a kid such as your’s Lisa.
Aside from that it doesn’t matter what they think,as long as they comply with his IEP.
Now,I KNOW he feels uncomfortable about the accomodations,but what does he really think of them? Does he understand them? Is he willing to work harder instead? If he is,let him.

My child also has mixed receptive expressive language problems,central auditory processing disorder,sequencing problems.She has good visual memory and is doing well with the “Spalding” method take a look into it as it has improved my daughters spelling.My tutor is delightfully surprised at how well she is doing on it.Now if I can get the school in sync with it as my child is in 4th grade and her spelling words are dad, mad -and my child is doing wife,story with the tutor.(GRIPE) Anyway how about using a tape recorder so if he misses anything in his notes it will be on tape.

I had the exact same problem last year. My son would cry because he thought the words were too easy. He didn’t study for spelling tests and got 100 on every one with words like sat, bat etc.
I asked several times for harder words and got no where.
I had to pull the school psych in. She helped explain to the teacher that he needed to be challenged with his spelling words. It worked, he got words that were more commensurate with his skill level. Even after getting harder words he still got 100 but had to study.

Lisa,

If his note taking is a developing skill, why not ask for notes from the teacher which he can use to supplement his own? I would think that this could be handled discretly so that he doesn’t call attention to himself. Then, if he can type, he could retype his notes and add what the teacher has that he doesn’t have.

Beth

Socks you are always so full of such useful information. I spoke with my son about his accomodations and what his thoughts on them were. He said the ones that would be helpful would be: a copy of the notes (to fill the gaps in his), he said he would still take notes best he could since he finds that writing the information down helps him retain it better. Extended time on tests because sometimes I just don’t get to finish them (this happened to him on the ISAT on one he scored below standards and barely met standards on the other). He says reading the tests himself helps improve his reading and he don’t mind the extra work of trying to figure it out himself. The spelling accomodation he says he definetly needs to keep because even using spell check he gets spelling wrong because spell check can not come up with a suggestion for what he is trying to spell. He has been to an IEP before but not the last one (he still had horrible memories from this and decided not to go). I told him when his next IEP is due that I would like for him to attend and he agreed. I let him know that I felt this IEP would be different because no one on this team felt he needed to be put on meds and sent for extensive counseling. He left this IEP feeling like something was seriously wrong with him, even his dad and I were caught off guard from the attitude. The other interesting thing I have found out since my orginal post is that is Lit teacher is the hardest teacher in his department, he really expects alot from “his kids”, including those on IEP’s. I think this is actually going to be a good thing because the harder he is pushed and challenged the harder he fights. He related to me and it was confirmed by others that even parents of “regular ed” kids have them removed from the class because it is too hard. I think it is just he wants them to have solid skills. My son says that so far besides the standard lit stuff he has gone over note taking, listening skills, study skills, organization and the like. His assignments appear to be making sure the kids understand the concepts. For example last night they read a short story then had to answer question like what is the setting (explain how you know this and where you found it) what is the time frame (again explain how you know this and where you found it) who is the antogonist/protagonist (what action or thing said lead you to this conclusion) who is the dynamic character (what action lead you to this conclusion). To me these seem like questions ensuring does not only the child know the definition but they can apply it. They also partner read (a great plus for my son), play games to enforce facts (kind of like a jeopardy game) and practice basic writing skills such as writing a sentence or paragraph for accuracy. I am very pleased with this years placement and support as is my son, he feels and I agree that it is this combination that is helping him to do well. Thanks for the great advice socks. Good luck to you and your wonderful boys this school year. When is their next big adventure field trip?

Lisa,

I wonder if there are courses on good note taking. If there isn’t there should be. This is such an important skill. I was the same as your son in school. I had a hard time writing down all the things the teacher said but writing things down helped implant things on my brain. I had to learn to mostly listen and pick out the most important points. I had to learn a sort of short hand, writing bullet points not word for word. I rarely studied my actual notes. Once I wrote something down, I remembered it.

This is a skill.

Maybe discuss with the teacher any ideas for helping him to learn to pull out important information and become a better listener/note taker.

Linda

Lisa,

My son had a Core teacher in 6th like the one your son has now. My son’s SAT-9 scores went way up that year in the language area. He also had high expectations of all his students but he would take a child from where they were and expected improvement from that level when it came to writing. I went in to class and helped correct the reading comprehension questions once a week and I saw a vast improvement in writing as the year progressed.

Helen

Helen, I hope this class helps to make my sons ISAT scores go up. I just got his 8th grade ISAT scores (last years test) he scored below standards on reading and math and barely passed the writing portion. He scored significantly below average on the reading (almost acedemic warning) missed passing the math portion by 7 points. If this is any indication on how he would score on a re-evaluation type test he would still qualify for services. It is important to note that he did not use any of his accomodations for this testing.

:-) I LOVE your kid! He really IS going to be just fine,I can almost garantee it.
Just the way he explains things,like,wanting to take notes,because it does help him retain things. He has some very good strategies in place naturally on his own,how cool is that?! As you know my two are severely dysgraphic,so even if they do take notes,you can not read it. They have one kid in class that they really like his notes,the way in which he does them,and they make a copy of them,before they leave for the day. There is carbon paper that you can buy that can be used for someone else to take notes and it will make a copy.You just put it between the two papers. OR the teacher can copy their notes and give it to him. You might try the book “Learning outside the lines” for your son. By Jonathan Mooney.An outstanding book of learning strategies written by an lder,who is a young adult. A young adult who graduated with honors in English Lit. from Brown University. Has 2nd grade reading and spelling skills,but managed to obtain a degree in English. He loves to write,and boy can he!As a matter of fact,I can ,if your kid is interested,get them together via email, to discuss the BS your kid’s teacher is giving him about the highly overrated skill called spelling. I wished you lived near me! He is coming down to do another talk at the boys school,and a small conference in our area.

My two are doing awsome:-) Both are really doing great with homework! They just finished studying for a Math test tommorow,my youngest actually asked his teacher to write a few more problems down for him before he left school today:-) I thought this was good,sure as hell beats the good old days of crying over too many problems! This year the spring trip is Washington DC. I told Dr Stark if I go as a chaperone,to hold me back when we visit the senate! He said,he wouldn’t dream of doing that! He hopes the kids will see a demonstration! I said,hell,lets have one of our own. He just smiled. My pooor kids,how embarassing is their mom?

Anyway,it shouldn’t be as costly to do fund raising for Washington,the other option was costa rica to see the volcano’s,glad I don’t have to fund raise for that! They will still be going back to Peru this summer. I have been informed that this is a mandatory summer program. According to my kids. They better sell more candy bars!

I’m in a similar position as socks in that I view things from the perspective of someone with a learning disability. I dropped out of my first year of high school and it took many failed attempts, DX, access to a word processor and accomodations for written exams before I was able to graduate from college at age 32. My advice would be to make sure your child gets all the support possible. You don’t want him to get discouraged or burnt out. He is obviously intelligent enough to help compensate for a lot of his weaknesses but he is still at huge risk. I’m just starting the with the special education challenges from a parent’s perspective. My five year old son has an ausistic spectrum disorder. I’m sure I could learn a lot from you. It sounds like both you and he have been doing a great job so far. Keep up the good work.

Lisa,

I hope your son’s scores do go up this year. Please consider that your son is successful because of all the supports he gets at home, the resource room and that his self-esteem is high. Remove the supports and his self-estemm might plumet and he could become a child at risk for failure. I would quess that when tested that your son’s IQ is now higher then it was in 2nd grade.
Take out last year’s ISAT scores and compare this years are they higher this year?

Helen

for good advice. :-)

for good advice. :-)

for good advice. :-)

Maybe you could barter candy bars for good advice :-)

///

Rose, besides my son who this thread is about I also have another son who falls on the autism spectrum. He is 10 now and like his brother has made great strides. If you ever need to talk or have a spesific question feel free to ask and I will see if I have any information pertaining to your question. Progress can be made with these kiddos you just need to have patience, the right programming, and a TON of determination. My major piece of advice is to treat your son like a typical 5 year old as much as possible. Sometimes especially with the information available it can be very discouraging knowing a childs dx, remember your son is a child who happens to have a disability, this does not mean he does not have typical child wants and needs. I am not saying you do this but I have seen parents treat their child differently who happens to have a label. It is important that you continue to fight and advocate for your child. My thought is a door is NEVER closed just harder to get through and if you can’t get through one door you have to be wise enough to know when to go on to the next. Sorry to get on my soap box but I hate when I hear stuff like I heard when my youngest son was dx’d, they told us you will be lucky if he potty trains by 5 and EVER gets functional language skills. I am so glad I did not take this advice to heart. You are your sons mom you know him better then anyone else. Yes, you need to seek advice, get help, ect, but you also must decide what is best for your child and what fits what you are being told. My husband says I am the forever optimist and maybe I am but I have never seen good come from dwelling on the negative. Look at your sons strength and help him make them stronger, help him imrove his weak areas, and learn to move on if something is impossible. Good luck to you and your son.

Rose, besides my son who this thread is about I also have another son who falls on the autism spectrum. He is 10 now and like his brother has made great strides. If you ever need to talk or have a spesific question feel free to ask and I will see if I have any information pertaining to your question. Progress can be made with these kiddos you just need to have patience, the right programming, and a TON of determination. My major piece of advice is to treat your son like a typical 5 year old as much as possible. Sometimes especially with the information available it can be very discouraging knowing a childs dx, remember your son is a child who happens to have a disability, this does not mean he does not have typical child wants and needs. I am not saying you do this but I have seen parents treat their child differently who happens to have a label. It is important that you continue to fight and advocate for your child. My thought is a door is NEVER closed just harder to get through and if you can’t get through one door you have to be wise enough to know when to go on to the next. Sorry to get on my soap box but I hate when I hear stuff like I heard when my youngest son was dx’d, they told us you will be lucky if he potty trains by 5 and EVER gets functional language skills. I am so glad I did not take this advice to heart. You are your sons mom you know him better then anyone else. Yes, you need to seek advice, get help, ect, but you also must decide what is best for your child and what fits what you are being told. My husband says I am the forever optimist and maybe I am but I have never seen good come from dwelling on the negative. Look at your sons strength and help him make them stronger, help him imrove his weak areas, and learn to move on if something is impossible. Good luck to you and your son.

now THAT is good advice!

Socks would love it if you could hook the two of them up. I think it would be very helpful for him to “talk” to someone who has made it despite their learning differences.

Looks like your boys are in for another exciting year! You must be very proud of them for all their efforts. Hope the rest of the school year goes well for you and your boys.