Profile of a child who caught up

I know that some parents feel that if the child cannot get what he needs at school to learn it is unfair to give that child more work outside of school hours. I understand that feeling— every kid needs time just to be a kid. On the other hand, I think many LD kids, regardless of the quality of in-school instruction, simply need more help than they can get during school hours. I know my son did. It is absolutely true that he would have been happier playing with his friends than working with me (or tutors) on finding ways over, around and through his LDs, but I think that if he had not done this he would never has made the progress he has. My son was in a very appropriate class (a gt/ld classroom) and I think that had much to do with his success. However, without those extra hours after school and on the weekend, working with occupational therapists and tutors and counselors, there is no way he would have come as far. I’m proud to say that as a result of my son’s hard work, he has “graduated” from special ed and will be attending a school for gifted students in the fall. A lot of times parents feel like they are helpless to deal with these problems and that if the school can’t fix them they just won’t ever be fixed. I think your post shows how the right approach, at school and at home, can make a real difference.

Andrea

Thanks for the comments. It is tough to make some of these calls, on parents, that is. Yes, we want our children to participate in activities outside of school and to have relaxation time. But, in the overall scheme of things, how much value are some of these and where is the balance?

Clearly, people vary in temperment and in talents along various lines. Some people have the temperment and the work ethic, naturally, to commit the time and make the effort to excell or to learn, even when they are not driven by anxious parents. Others who have all the talent in the world never push themselves, indeed sometimes don’t even do the minimum.

There probably isn’t one correct formula for the percentage of time that should be allocated to academic and school learning outside of school hours. Some parents ask for less homework and others want more. Some students will put in the time, others won’t.

It is clear that not all students will learn the same material in the same length of time and there is only so much time within the school day that can be manipulated to that end. So, either our school system changes almost totally (not a bad idea, but the current trends toward increased standardized testing and standards are probably changes in the opposing direction of what our LD students really need) or we find the time somewhere else.

I support parents who are willing contributors to doing what it takes. I know I pull at home for my daughter who is not handicapped, but who does need some 1:1 attention from me to be able to achieve some of the grade level standards (she had perfectly normal intelligence and no LDs, the standards and expectations are set pretty high and teachers have never had the 1:1 time to teach to her needs).

Andrea wrote:On the
> other hand, I think many LD kids, regardless of the quality
> of in-school instruction, simply need more help than they can
> get during school hours.
I agree. I taught a boy in middle school for three years. When h came to me he could only read three letter words and not always those. He had very poor phonological skills. We worked very hard and by the time he went to high school he was reading Goosebumps books. He needed more time and more one on one instruction. His mother hired a tutor and the tutor came to school to get material from me on a regular basisi. I think this was the key. We were all doing the same thing as far as instruction and it finally worked. He just needed lots of practice.

Thank you for this post, Andrea! As a sp. ed. teacher, it is wonderful to see
more success stories like this! I’m sure you must be proud! God bless you…..
and good luck!

I too “after-schooled” my child for several years before I began homeschooling her in 7th grade. At the end of 6th grade, she tested with multiple deficits (APD, VPD, dysnomia) and was reading at the 3rd grade level. She completed FFW (by me at home), IM (therapiest), PACE & MTC (by me at home). She was tested again and at the end of 8th grade, she was reading at the 11th grade level!! This past year (9th) she took physical science, art, computer application and mixed chorus at the local public school, making the “A” honor roll! I truly believe that none of this would have happened without the many wonderful therapies and reading programs now available combined with 1:1 instruction. One can never underestimated the power of a determined child and parent working together!

Blessings, momo

What a great story! Congratulations on your success and thanks for the encouragement.

All I can say to this is, how are the PARENTS ABLE to find the proper remediation or intervention for their children to make progress and it takes only a couple of hours a week “extra” yet it can’t be accomplished during the school day? It is called Individual Educational Plan (IEP) for a reason.

These tutors you hire are not miracle workers or geniuses, so why is this not happening in the educational setting with educational professionals who are paid for their expertise. Other children are getting what they need to succeed during the school day, why is your child not entitled to the same thing; APPROPRIATE (not sloppy seconds) education.

What is wrong with this picture? This makes absolutely no sense. Wake up parents, you are buying their excuses again when you accept this as logical.

Actually, LuLu, my point was that this child seemed to have a single deficit and she did NOT qualify for special education services at school. She was a little below, but her processing STRENGTHS partially offset her weaknesses.

Initial reading instruction at her school was probably not strong on phonology.

I am particularly interested in learning which profiles are most likely to “catch up” when given good teaching. My theory is that a single deficit child probably does not need special education when that child has good first instruction. A multiple deficit child may still qualify for and need special education services, even then that that child (depending upon how severe the deficits are and the profile of strengths) may not ever fully “catch up,” though the child will learn to read.

This parent worked dutifully, 1:1, every day with her child using materials the paid tutor provided and trained her in using The paid tutor felt this daily “coaching” was an essential contributor to the success. This was NOT a couple of hours a week of extra, it was intensive and daily.

Momo, this is the kind of information I am interested in. Perhaps the several therapies you used did ultimately work. In order to get many schools investing in these therapies, we will need some decent, scientific and replicable studies of the effectiveness of programs like PACE, etc.

Thanks for sharing.

I saw the point with your individual case.

I was responding to Andrea’s comments about parents feelings in general.

Point being that many parents who visit the board have results outside of the classroom with private tutors only a few hours a week. If they can see results and progression with this minimal amount of supplemental support, imagine where the child would be if given the PROPER instruction during school FIVE days a week.

I also tutor children (mostly jr. high math and reading comprehension/study strategies) without special needs. They make astounding gains in 1:1 environment. As I know you know, it is the optimum teaching environment for any student (for skill acquisition) because of immediate and focused feedback. Lessons are paced to that individual student, too. I put the skill acquisition there because I do think some things are learned best in a community of learners rather than singly. Social skills, for example.

Every child would learn skills at their optimum if 1:1 were provided. We all know that cannot happen in public schools else we raise taxes to the rafters and beyond. Many parents who are able to spend the money, do so because they know the benefits of 1:1 work.

I think your theory about multiple deficits has much merit. Sometimes, even with one child, I feel like I’m sorting out three-four puzzles in one big box. Then I have to put them all together separately. Now take that times my *very modest* caseload of 15. Some have many more on their loads.

Lulu,

I don’t think I said that a few hours a week of tutoring is what made the difference for my child. Instead, my point was that some children, including my own, even when they receive appropriate in-school services, still need something more. Just FYI, my son was very fortunate in that his class size never exceed 10 children and usually was about 8 children. He regularly received many hours of in-school one-on-one attention. Even so, he needed more than the school could possibly provide and so we provided it at home over many years and at great cost. This was by no means a quick solution. My son, now age 11, began receiving privately provided help at age 5. I would do it again in an instant because I know that this was what he needed to progress. I completely agree that there are many schools that are not making enough effort to teach our children in the way they need to learn. Certainly your son’s school is a prime example of that and you are right to push them to do right by your child. It is your choice whether to try to provide remediation at your own expense outside of school and I am sure that you make your decisions based on your evaluation of what is best for your children. I sense from your various posts that you feel parents ought to be battling with schools to provide what is needed rather than providing it themselves. I see your point, and even agree with it to a certain extent, but what is a parent to do when the school is not doing its job and the child is losing precious time? Some parents opt to spend their emotional and financial resources on privately-provided therapies rather than battles with the school. That is their evaluation of what is best for their own child. There is no right or wrong to this. It is simply a question of parents doing the best they can, based on how they see things. Some of them don’t see it as you do, but that does not mean that they are being duped. Certainly they don’t deserve to hear themselves described “buying excuses” or being illogical. It is much more likely that they are painfully aware of the differences between what their children need and what the schools are providing and just making the best of a bad situation.

Andrea

I am new to this website and was intrigued by your triumph. I was wondering how old your child is and how long he was receiving services.
My daugher is entering second grade and will be 8 in Sept. First grade, last year was the 1st year in 3 years we did not supplement with direct outside therapy. Although, she does go to karate to address motor planning issues and a social skills group. This is also the first summer she did not do “summer school” in 3 years so she could “just be a kid”. Instead, we did some individualized tutoring and small group language therapy and swimming lessons. It was more confusing and I’m not sure if we will go this route next summer. It was worth a shot.
It is difficult to explain why she has spent half her life on a very busy schedule. We have seen some progress but not as much as you’d like to see, given all the effort on her part and ours. I hope this wasn’t too long for you.

I couldn’t read in 1st grade. I was in the last reading group and an embarassment to my father, a highly regarded teacher, and my mother, a 7th generation local. Everyone knew I was in the last reading group. There were no IEP’s back then. The only special ed classes went to the zoo a lot. If you couldn’t read, well - a lot of people couldn’t read very well.

My mother used my Dad’s sources to purchase the reading books used in the District. She worked with me every day - the same story over and over - until I got it.

By the end of 2nd grade I was in the advanced group.

I taught my own children to read at age 5. I urge parents who are having troubles to work with their children daily - even if there’s an IEP. I wouldn’t throw my sons to the baals of public education by waiting. As a teacher I know fully well that most qualified special educators are now heavily involved at the county level making sure the paperwork is correct and the federal govt stays off their ass. (You can guess my feelings about the impact of IDEA! The clothes have no emperor!)

LD children are crammed - sometimes 15-20 to a class and are supposed to learn to read. Yeah, right. I don’t blame the teacher - I blame the people who vote “NO” to funding (often while demanding everything for their own kid), the regular administrators who loot special ed funds, and this entire culture which places money and entertainment over education and children.

Thanks to my mom’s gumption, I not only can read - I now lecture on reading. God Bless every parent who works hard for their child.

Just a question - does your son STILL have to work harder than everyone else for the same result - in his new class?

While this is not the most popular opinion on this board, I agree unequivocably.

Julie,

My son is 11 and going into 6th grade. He began receiving publicly provided services in second grade. He was placed in a self-contained classroom for gifted children with learning disabilities, and he consistently received accomodations and remediation for his learning disabilities while being provided with challenging work that fed his giftedness. He also received OT, at first twice a week, then just once a week. (We had provided this with our own resources before he was identified.) The OT helped a lot with gross and fine motor issues, handwriting and with very practical things like buttoning, shoe tying and learning how to type. I think this combination of services was essential to his success. My son also began taking stimulant medication for his inattentive ADHD in 4th grade and that has helped him a lot, especially with being able to stick with things that he finds difficult or boring. Before (and after) the medication we also used behavior modification for the ADHD symptoms and good old play therapy to help him with feelings of anger and depression. At the suggestion of a parent on this board, we also signed my son up for therapeutic riding classes and those have been a real success. Throughout all of this he was regularly tutored by a special education teacher. It took a long time before we saw the fruits of all of these efforts, but I am convinced that early and constant intervention is crucial. Your child is very young yet and I am sure that as you continue to provide her with help and support she will continue to progress. Good luck to you!

Andrea

Leah,

Well, he hasn’t started yet, but I suspect that the answer is (and always will be) yes. LD is a lifelong condition and I think my son will always have to work harder than other people. On the other hand, I think he has been given abilities that other people don’t have and that these gifts will help him overcome his difficulties. My goal is for him to recognize and accept his abilities and his disabilities and to learn how deal with both. My son has an amazing capacity for hard work and commitment, given the right resources and support, and we have talked quite a bit the fact that sometimes he has to work harder than other people and about the LDs that are the reason for this. I have told him that even though this probably seems unfair, in a way he is lucky because he is a strong and capable person who is able to take on this extra burden. I’ll probably have to work hard right along with him, but, as I see it, that’s my job as a parent.

Andrea

I think maybe my point was misunderstood and I’m sorry if I offended you, not my intention, honest.

From your post it sounds like your son is in a specialized classroom. You are very fortunate to live in a district that still believes in this. We, like many of the other “outspoken” posters here have been forced into an inclusion model and for the most part our children are not receiving the intervention they need to become independent, successful students. They are merely being passed along under the guise of being assisted by special education and the school is receiving funds to do this job.

You said that “some parents don’t see it the way you do.” I’m not sure that I would agree. But you feel that the school is doing everything they can for your child, he has even received 1:1 attention. I hope you understand that this is not the norm. You obviously feel that your son’s range of disabilities exceed what the school can supply. Again, I would have to say, that this is not the norm when it comes to school-identified SLDs. Most are not severe enough to even require placement in a specialized classroom. So why are these children not seeing success?

Many parents of children with LDs have to hire tutors in order for their children to pass and succeed. But why? We went through the testing process, wrote and IEP and review after review they tell me he is doing fine. He is not doing fine with “their” interventions. His grades, his observed progress and his emotional well-being during the school year are proof of this. What if families cannot afford to provide this for their child. Does that mean the child does not deserve to succeed?

So the point, why bother with the special ed program at all if you are not going to provide what they truly need?

My son is only entitled to accomodations and modifications, not remediation even though he is reading almost 2 grade levels behind his peers. So, if we actually want to teach him how to read effectively, we have to hire a tutor and he has to do this outside of school.

Why should he have to learn to read OUTSIDE of school? A non-LD parent would not accept this arrangement for their children. That is why he is there for 7 hours, no?

Now, in extreme cases, where the child has a wide range of disabilities, YES, it would be impossible to address all of his issues during the school day.

But the reason we created and pay taxes for special education is just that. These children are not able to meet the standards with traditional instruction. Therefore a special plan is needed for instruction. There is no reason why my child should not be taught how to read (with “special education”) during the school day.

If they do not have the resources to provide this instruction we can go for private placement. The catch is having to go through due process because they are going to fight parents on this. So parents give up and take matters into their own hands by hiring a tutor or two or three to take care of the child’s needs.

The role of the specialized staff for special education is to provide such instruction, instead we get the excuses when we question their methods or the lack of progress.

I’m very happy that you have found success and I am not judging those who choose to hire professionals outside of school. But the intent of school (7 hours a day) is to teach a child to read, write and do math calculations. Identifying them as needing special instruction should ensure that this is happening.

I’m not advocating a “wait till they provide it” mentality, I’m saying that if we continue to accept this as “acceptable” things will never change. They won’t have to, because they know that parents will give up or accept their excuses and provide the remediation themselves.

And the most ironic thing of all is that the people we are hiring are many times ex-sped teachers or gen. ed teachers. How are they able to help a child make progress outside of school, yet couldn’t do it during the hours of 8-3:30 when they were being paid tax dollars vs. private pay.

I’m with you. I also have a gifted/LD daughter who has to work harder than everyone else to produce the same amount of work. She is still in reading and OT tutoring, but making significant progress and able to attend gifted resource at school. She also uses computers for her writing work.

Good for you. I think you’re right. Sounds like you’ve helped your son become quite a hard worker.

You write

I hate to tell you this, but this is NOT the intent of the school. Many individual schools, and all school boards, will have some sort of official document giving their educational philosophy. You should look at some of these documents some time, to find out what we are all dealing with all the time.
You will find a lot of motherhood-and-apple pie generalities about “developing good citizens” and “teaching the whole child” and “each child reaching his/her potential” — all of which we of course all agree with as generalities (and the cynics among us believe that’s why this stuff is there).
You will find very very little about the three R’s. You will in most cases find no academic standards whatsoever. Sure, there are general statements about “the need for a qualified workforce” and “preparing students for the demands of the twenty-first century”, but nothing is put down about what qualified should mean and how we meet those demands.

Then take a look at the elementary curriculum guides provided by the state and/or county for the teacher in the classroom. Again you will find many motherhood-and-apple-pie issues: self-esteem is the big one recently; personal development, individual development, saying no to drugs and alcohol, conflict resolution, good citizenship, healthy habits, exercise and nutrition, and on and on. Of course none of us will speak out against any of these things! But the cynics among us note that if you use up hours on drug awareness, health and nutrition, conflict resolution, self-esteem discussions, and so on, then those hours can no longer be spent on teaching kids basic literacy. Priorities have to be set, and in many schools and classrooms, literacy is not the first priority (and sometimes not second or third.). The reading scores speak for themselves.

One time I was hired to help turn around a school whose academic level had sunk very low, along with more than half the staff including the principal being new, working with the middle school math and science and getting back on grade level. I tried and tried. After a month or so I sat down and tried to figure out what was going on and why we were unable to ever do anything. After looking at an actual week, I realized that the students were spending much less than half their class day actually in class. Gee, why were people surprised that the Grade 8 class had Grade 4 average achievement? I won’t even get into the behaviour when they did actually get into class. The day I decided to leave, the principal gave me a hour-long lecture about how this was supposed to be the happiest time in the kids’ lives, how they should feel that their teachers were their very best friends and they could talk to their teachers about anything at all and tell all their problems; and that the students felt I was a cold and unfeeling person and all I cared about was math and science. She never let me get a word in edgewise, so I never did get an answer to the question of what they thought they had hired me for…
Not being a psychological counsellor or adolescent buddy, I realized that we had both made a mistake and left as soon as possible, unfortunately not before she intentionally made a fool of me in front of the class.

This teachers who tutor out of school and succeed in teaching will tell you two things: one is that one-to-one teaching is much more effective, and this is just a fact of life and not the fault of the school or teacher or anyone; the other is that being out of the bureaucracy and being able to actually spend an hour just *teaching*, and being able to choose methods that are effective rather than politically popular, is a breath of fresh air and of course they do a better job when they’re allowed to go ahead and do it.

By the way, many people who do not have a lot of money do manage to tutor their children individually; some buy books and teach themselves to be the tutor and do a fine job of it, while others work more for the extra money.
As a tutor I always feel bad if people feel they can’t afford my services, but when I give help away for free to charitable organizations, the students treat the free services as worthless and skip out, while those who work hard to pay are dedicated.

I would catagorize my dd as a single deficit profile, but is very severe on the auditory processing spectrum. She has some kind of integration issue when it comes to AP.

In what should have been her Kindergarten year (she was in a Montesorri pre-K/K class), by the end of the year, she still could not remember the names of letters - not even A,B,C after drilling every night, names of numbers, sing simple songs, difficulty rhyming. Her teacher stated that she had never had a more puzzling child.

We actually ‘caught’ her up, such that the following year she was at the head of her class vs. bottom. Sound Therapy, Earobics, NACD program were all primary reasons. These programs remediated her out of being handicapped in a number of subtests to low average to average - this was very key. She now could learn.

However, to keep her ‘caught’ up, has been challenging. Although, majority(if not all) of her AP skills are in the average range now, she still maintains a huge split between VP and AP and I think this is a critical issue for her. So, 1st grade we did Audiblox and Reading Reflex and 2nd grade we did PACE/MTC. We will continue PACE/MTC for 3rd grade and am hoping to be able to fit in Language Wise and potentially private SLP.

.

Dea,

My son also has an integration auditory deficit. One thing we did this spring that seems to have helped a lot was Interactive metronome. Now my son also has motor planning issues so the program may not be appropriate for your daughter. But I also read a study talking about auditory processing improving.

Not that you need another program…..

Beth

Thanks - actually IM has crossed my mind. I found an IM therapist here locally that I was very impressed with (she even does Sanomas with alot of her clients). I have been curious to see how my dd would test. I actually think my son would benefit from IM!!!

My dd doesn’t seem to have any motor issues or really any timing issues(did well with the PACE exercises and metronome). She is very coordinated - both small and large motor. However, I think maybe IM might be good for low-level attention issues and that’s good to know about auditory integration(I really think this is a problem for her, but I don’t quite know how to diagnose it or address it)? My son has the motor/timing issues and his processing speed is much slower than the rest of his mental skills abilities(on the PACE test he scored age level, but was at an adult level on all of the other tests- he was age 10 at the time. He scored better than I did!!) and I am thinking IM might be good for his self confidence and baseball, but probably overkill!

I’m sort of thinking IM may be on our agenda for 4th grade!! Depending on how 3rd grade goes??

I also am suspecting some visual issues - that again may all be related to the ‘integration’ thing. I’m thinking I need to find a new DO that would do a very thorough visual perceptual test on her. But I’m very afraid of the results - I think I will break down if they recommend intense vision therapy. It’s just NOT on the agenda - don’t have the time for it.

I am happy to hear about success stories. However, it seems to me there are not enough of them. I have heard too many times not to expect too much of “these” kids.

I think that is a true mistake kids are amazing and want encouragement and to be told they can do it not that it is too hard for them.

Marion,
It would look like advertising if I wrote of successes. There are many valid approaches out there and each offers hundreds, if not hundreds of thousands, of success stories. Most failures in this country are the result of blatant neglect. PERIOD>

DEA, one thing that really shows up usually with visual processing is that the child will struggle with board copying.

I know how you feel about one more program. We were just told that my daughter might need speech therapy - we’re wating on an appt. for an eval.

She has only minor articulation problems, but word retrieval is the problem. I dont know how we can afford to add another therapy to our already packed schedule.

Board copying has always been one of her strengths. Her K teacher told us her handwriting was that of a 3rd grader. Interestingly, when she has to write on her own (without that visual picture in front of her) her handwriting is not nearly as neat. She has very high visual spatial skills and overall her visual processing is like 4-5 years over age level.

I’m suspecting tho, that she might be having some tracking issues. I don’t think they are severe, but she is exhibiting some traits that are making me suspect.

Well, you could take her for a pretest and see how she does. I did hear that one of the FL private high schools put their whole football team through it. Not only did their football improve, their grades went up!!! I understand that 70 ms off beat is normal for untrained child. My son scored over 300 before he did Neuronet, and over 200 ms after NN but before IM. So pretty obvious that he could benefit from it.

It also helps focus which is useful in and of itself.

The vision stuff is really difficult. We still are having trouble even after vision therapy. The NN therapy has helped but wondering whether should still pursue it more. I heard of a really good OD about 40 miles from here. Don’t want to even think about it. So I know how you feel!!

Beth

I have an 11 year old who was adopted out of El Salvador at almost three, and came home with frank protein-deficiency malnutrition. She was initially considered to be mildly mentally handicapped, but further investigation showed that she had chronic untreated ear infections, CAPD, a secondary language disability, a visual processing disorder, sleep apnea, reading and spelling difficulties, ADD, organizational problems, and fine and gross motor coordination lags. At this point, post (1) Fast Forword 1&2 (2) Lindamood Bell V&V, (3) Writing Road to Reading, (4) Interactive Metronome, (5) two years of vision therapy, (6) PACE (7) a combination of gymnastics and karate, (8) three sets of tubes (9) T&A and four years of orthodontic work to correct the hypoplastic mandible which both contributed to and resulted from her sleep apnea, and (10) huge amounts of parental one-on-one tutoring, she is of average intelligence, scores at the 50th to 80th percentile on ERB testing in all areas except vocabulary, (vocabulary is now after another summer from hell at the 30th percentile up from the 1st percentile at the beginning of the summer.) She is working about a year and a half ahead of grade in mathematics, is gifted at Spanish and music, and is getting A’s and B’s at the leading college preparatory day school in our city. They are not aware that she ever had any learning problems, although she tests well below their population whose median ERB scores range from the 90-97th percentile. (She never had an IEP during her time in public school, and had several moves from school to school which successfully lost the medical record.) She is now off all meds, has a nice strong jaw and normal auditory and visual processing, and the braces (which now look normal since half the kids are wearing them at her current age) are expected to come off in another year.

The only hole right now is her organizational skills, which are crummy, but I am hoping for time and maturity to improve matters. If not, I shall send her to Culver Girls Academy, http://www.culver.org/students/cga.asp which is an excellent, boarding, college-preparatory military school a couple of hours away when she is is ready for ninth grade. (It is better that she screw up ninth grade than freshman year of college, and she WOULD learn to organize there.) She has seen it, and is hoping to go because they have a really great sports program, and a terrific flight school, and she wants to get her private pilot’s license when she is old enough. I have misinformed her that you need a BS in engineering to be a commercial pilot, and hope she will go to Purdue University school of engineering for college. She is not opposed to the notion, but does not like the concept of Purdue because it has ugly school colors. (The way in which eleven year old girls make major life decisions is a never failing source of wonder to me, but I have written to Purdue suggesting they change their colors to blue and green. I don’t think that will happen.)

Shirin

I remember a post from a gal that use to contribute alot on this board several years ago - her dd has vision problems and she had alot of good information that she contributed. I can’t remember her name now?

But anyway, I remember she said that you had to really watch the vision issues - problems can creep back or new problems pop up as kids develop. So you have to keep having them re-checked.

You know, I can’t even muster the energy for more testing anymore. I just feel tested out! But I do think the IM would be an interesting one to do a pre-test on for both my kids?

My gut feel is that dd has tracking issues that aren’t severe, but causing unnessary hurdles. I’m hoping that maybe if we go back and re-do some of the PACE tracking exercies, read and re-read, we can resolve at home with what we are currently doing. There was one point during PACE that I noticed what I think are maybe tracking problems, get alot better, and then she kind of fell back to her old routine.

Thanks for the info!

Shirin, I just wanted to let you know that you were one of the people that ‘inspired’ me 3years ago, to not listen to those who said - ‘you just need to learn to cope’.

I wish I had your knowledge. I know I’m still missing pieces of the puzzle with my dd, but we feel pretty good about her progress.

Thanks for sharing! You still continue to ‘inspire’ me to keep going and not give up!

DEA,

I see exactly what you are talking about but not related to vision. It is related to my son’s fine motor and graphomotor issues.

When he was 4 I was told by his teachers that he needed to work on his fine motor. So we looked for pennies in play dough, poured water from pitchers, colored, he buttered his own toast and peeled his own hardboiled eggs,he even wore a button down shirt every day to kindergarten that he had to button himself.

Just the other day he asked me to open a juice carton. I said “Are you saying that at camp they have to open these for you.” He said, “Yeah” I was shocked. I guess we just let those issues go as we started to work on other areas.

So we are back to the old routine. He understands that these muscles are weak and is very willing to do what he needs too to strenghten them.

It really can be exhausting at times.

Linda F

Shirin has got to be the most inspiring and hopeful poster ever. I’m sure it’s not only DEA and me who at some point were ready to throw in the towel but kept on going because of something Shirin had written. So many just dwell on our children’s limitations; Shirin dwells on their potential. She knows so much about various ways to bring it out and has been uncommonly generous with her knowledge as has her sister Shari. Their story never fails to inspire me. (P.S. Shirin, if you have any of your old posts stored away on your computer you might forward them to Victoria, who is collecting posts for a FAQ on this board. I have a printout of an old one of yours on raising IQs that’s been deleted from the archive that I have volunteered to retype for her—it’s way too valuable to stay tucked away in my files.)

Me too!! You were posting a lot when I first came searching on this board. IT made a difference in what I have done for my son.

Thanks.

Beth

Dea,

I was thinking about your post and Shirin’s experience. I remember her posting that after FFW, the CAPD was gone. Well, my son’s decoding deficits were gone post FFW, but that just allowed us to see that his core problems are related to integration. All other auditory processing tests are now normal.

I think integration problems are very difficult to fix, especially if they are on the cognitive level as well, as my son’s are. We did see progress with IM as well as much with Neuronet. His NN therapist has told us though that if we can’t get his visual-auditory integration automatic, he will always have residual problems. We may get there—he is way outside normal remediation for her therapy—but we made a big leap post IM. Interestingly enough, Robin G’s interpretation of his Woodcock Johnson a few weeks ago was very much in line with what I have been told by audiologists about his processing—the individual pieces aren’t bad, it is the putting it together that is problematic.
Beth

Your point is well-taken. It would be much better situation if appropriate services and remediation were always available in school.

Thanks for the vote of appreciation guys. I’m afraid I do NOT have any of my old posts, as they were eaten during a virus attack a couple of years ago. If you are working on a FAQ sheet, however, I can offer you the text from the Learning Disorders section at http://www.gracefwi.com/ I wrote it, and you may use it as you will. :)

shirin

My 10 year old 4th grade son who falls on the autism spectrum is SLOWLY closing the gap of what he should know and what he knows. The key I think is that from a very early age (3) he has had 24 hour a day 7 day a week remediation of sorts. That is not to say that we work with him 24/7—let me explain. He received his first IEP at the age of 3, the IEP was constructed by the school, the parents, and his day care providers. A program was set in place where he would be worked with using the same technique throughout the day. His daycare sent providers to receive training to work with him, we were provided training in the various methods, and the school had personnel who were also trained. All his IEP’s have been worked in this manner, everyone who has contact with him gets to have input. He is a member of the Cub Scouts who have also willingly received training, he has taken swimming lessons, ect. We have been very fortunate in that his care and teaching has been a community thing. We share what we know, people lend us a hand. I think this arrangement works well because no the school can not do it all and neither can the parents. I have been vey excited by my sons progress he can now read small chapter books (currently reading the Sponge Bob series), write a paragraph, and excels at math and computers. I dont think he would of come this far without the community support we have received.

We haven’t tried Neuronet, although we did get a boost with IM. We didn’t get much of a boost with PACE, but at this point the kid had received so much intervention that it is hard to know whether or not PACE is useful for most kids. I keep toying with the notion of doing Instrumental Enrichment with her, but most of that seems to involve stuff which she is now beyond, and I’m not sure it would be the best use of her time.

I agree that integration of the subskills is tricky, but I think that what kids with problems there really need is to first get the subskills automatic and then spend vast amounts of time over-learning putting them all together one-on-one. We spent years going over the same ground in different ways over and over again. It did eventually come together. By the end of fourth grade I was able to quit going over multiplication, division, fraction, and decimal facts, and last year (fifth grade) she was working out of Saxon Math 6/7 (designed for average seventh graders and gifted 6th graders) and all I did to help was shove the book at her and say “Look it up” when she had trouble with a concept. I was also able to stop taking her daily reading and allow her to read silently by the end of fourth grade, but I still had to help her in English last year because her teacher conducted the class on a really high level, (all the assigned books were at a sixth to seventh grade reading level), and she expected a great deal of inferencing, predicting, discussion of personalities and themes, and cross-correlation of the text with other books and experiences. Those subskills were still extraordinarily difficult for Karen until more than halfway through fifth grade. I am hoping they will become easier this coming school year.

After you finish beating integration into the ground, the next set of dragons seem to be organization and self-discipline. That’s where I am now. Possibly because I have spent so much time organizing, tutoring, and generally angsting over Karen, she is incredibly disorganized. For example, I must have bought her at least three copies of every book she needed in English last year, because she lost them just about every day. Furthermore, she does not have the self-discipline to stick with difficult academic work (e.g. English and Science) unless I am around. Yet I know she now is capable of handling these subjects with little help. She generally gets her math homework out of the way without my having to remind her, and she does her homework and writes long reports in Spanish and Social Studies with minimal prodding on my part, because she likes the subjects. That’s why I’m thinking of military school.

We looked at Howe Military Academy http://www.howemilitary.com/ this week, and she really liked it and asked to take their admissions test, and did very well. They would like to have her. Howe has rather a large campus, is all-boarding, mostly boys, plain but cheerful, very rural, and TINY; (only 30 students in each grade and about 12 students in a class). Expectations are clear, teaching is good, and there is no busy work. Homework gets done in each company’s barracks with the tactical staff supervising, and privileges for cadets and the companies to which they are assigned depend on both academic performance and good conduct. The boys are assigned to companies by ages but stay with them throughout their tenure at the school. The girls all belong to the same company. There is a lot of emphasis on sports and drill both of which she would enjoy. Furthermore, it is only an hour and a half away; close enough that she could come home every open weekend if she had privileges. Academically speaking Howe is not nearly as good as her current school http://www.canterburyschool.org/ but it is better than the local public school (which incidentally, has an excellent reputation), and nearly as good as the local day-school competition for Canterbury. It might be easier for Karen to learn to organize and discipline herself if the academic work was not also a stretch, and she might have time to read the kind of books which actually interest her if she did not have to keep up with the mandatory school reading list. (This would be a good thing. To keep up with Canterbury’s assigned reading, you need to finish one of the books on their list about every two weeks. We are discussing complex, 200+ page novels which have been clearly chosen for their literary merit, not necessarily their appeal to children.) I am thinking of sending her to Howe for seventh grade, and would be interested in people’s thoughts on this subject.

If I don’t send her there, I may send her to Culver Girls Academy at ninth grade. The Culver Academies are mostly boarding high schools which are equal to Canterbury in terms of academic excellence, and have outstanding opportunities in terms of sports. BUT (1) while Culver’s brother school is a military school, the girls academy runs under the prefect system which is more amenable to petty bullying than the military system imo. (2) Girls tend to be far more verbal than boys, and a single sex school might run Karen into unnecessary problems in an area of weakness. Karen’s strengths and weaknesses at this point are more boyish than girlish. (3) Each grade at Culver has more than twice as many kids as each grade in Canterbury, and six times as many as at Howe. She might get lost in the system. (4) If I delay boarding school until high school, this means she will likely screw up ninth grade due to her disorganization, whereas if I send her to Howe in one year, she will at worst, screw up seventh grade which is relatively low-cost in terms of her academic future. Howevre she might not screw up anything at all, simply because the difficulty level of the work would have decreased, allowing her more “working space” in which to handle organization and self-discipline. Again, I would be interested in your thoughts on this subject.

P.S. Karen is resilient and makes friends very easily, and would have NO trouble living away from home. .

Academically speaking Howe is not nearly as good as her current school http://www.canterburyschool.org/ but it is better than the local public school (which incidentally, has an excellent reputation), and nearly as good as the local day-school competition for Canterbury.

Well, I have looked at SAT and ISTEP scores. Contrary to what I was told, Howe’s suck. It is clearly a bad boy school. She ain’t going. I MAY send her to Culver at ninth grade, but Culver’s ISTEP and SAT scores are in line with our local (excellent) public high school, and rather lower than Canterbury’s. It will ONLY happen if she is still a disorganize twit at that age.