Voc-Rehab stinks

Re Voc.-Rehab Stinks: Ain’t that the truth New York!? I live in CA, and out here they practice ‘Priority of Service’ which involves a ‘POINT SPREAD’ system to dole out their services!! One must have 16 points to get services, and I have 15 points!! The common theme seems to be that if one has a ‘Congenital Injury’ (ie Difficult Birth due to Medical Incompetence) VS. that of an On the Job Injury/IOD Status Injury, the CA Voc. Rehab folks basically leave the Congenital Injures at the ‘Starting Line’ to use the Horse Racing metaphor!! There was a DR on AT HOME LIVE WITH CHUCK AND JENNY/ athomelive.com is the web-site!! This DR. has a new book out on the subject of LD/ADD!! It looks promising!!

So, as the saying goes—BE YOUR OWN BEST ADVOCATE!!
Take Care!!

In NYS and NYC if you have a LD and you earn below $15,000 and live on yoyr own you have to fight and be willing to fight and you have to have a plan and tell them what they want. However if you have a LD live on welfare and or any other type of Public Assistance and toy have a plan then youo have a better chance of gettign what youy want fom VESID. you always have to be one step ahead of them.

Dear Carol,

I agree with you because in Indiana, if a person is on Medicaid and Social Security (due to low income and a disability) then that person pretty much has it made since all the doctors appts., medications, and hospital visits are paid for. The BIG problem comes into play is when you, being the person on public assistance, wants to try and get your life together - go to see a “good” doctor, attend school, and try to be somewhat self sufficient is when public assistance makes you pay for your part of your medical expenses, even though you can’t afford it. Voc. Rehab. doesn’t even tell you about the loop holes, even though they are supossed to help you. Actually, there is a program that will help a person. I was told by Voc. Rehab. that it’s not the Social Security Office problem since they mainly deal with elderly individuals. I don’t by it for a minute! I am now hooked up with “The Center for Mental Health” in order to help me save money - I track all my mileage from Dr’s. appt.’s to work, etc. and then I don’t get as much money taken away from me. I’ts a shame that we, indiv.’s w/ LD’s have to stay a step ahead of everyone especially since we are the one’s who need the help … instead, it’s us who have to educate the so called professionals in the field. I agree about getting groups together and I’m going to contact my local agency as well to get a grass group formed as well..

Thanks for your input, and keep up the good work!
Maria

VOC REHAB AGENCIES ARE ACCOUNTABLE TO NO ONE THAT IS THE MAIN REASON THEY STINK!! IF YOU EXAMINE THEIR TRACK RECORD IN HELPING THE DIS ABLED YOU WILL SEE WHAT A WASTE THEY ARE.

Ask them 1. what is your budget? 2. How many clients do you have ? 3. How many did you help? They will stone wall and or B.S. you.Does your state senator have that info? I doubt it because chances are he does not want to know and the pimp running your state VR office doesn’t want anyone to know. I doubt if their books could bear close scrutiny.

It’s important to be accurate in criticisim of them if you want to get places with this. That means if caseworkers are overloaded, it’s a good thing to highlite their efforts in the face of ludicrous odds.

Accuacy in any representation of a situation adds credibility to any negative observations about the situation you might be making, and helps defend against accusations (rightly or wrongly) of bias.

Accuracy is a weapon.

The other thing, as someone put it, `Don’t blame the player, blame the game’ is important too. It is the process you want to change, not the goals of it in this case.

I’m pretty sure you’d be amazed at the lengths most state agencies that are in the buisness of helping people who need it go to in trying to stretch money to do the most with it. Blaming the people who, day after day, come to jobs where they’re overloaded with cases, underfunded and underequipped to their jobs isn’t fair and doesn’t make sense. They’re on your side, and there’s no doubt in my mind that they’d prefer to have people reach their goals as much as possible.

That being the case, the people who’re the problem are the politicians and your fellow citizens. Directing energy towards them on the subject has a hell of a lot higher odds of creating some change than does blindly smearing the people who’re trying to help.

After reading your propaganda Tim, I’m wondering what I should do first put on hip boots or put a clothes pin on my nose. Is that the matra your clients here after you’ve strung them along for years? I don’t know who coined the phrase “don’t piss on my leg and tell me it’s raining” but does it ever apply here.I have been a chapter chairperson and on the steering comittees of several groups that represent disabled people The Voc Rehab goldbrickers never come to theses meetings. You’d think they’d want to gain insight. They never show because they prefer to keep their heads stuck in the sand or some other dark place. But maybe their 10 _4 jobs are just too taxxing on them. After all they only get an hour for lunch. Tim when was the last time you worked a real job? And Tim, if you are not part of solution you are part of the problem. In fact you are the problem. Tim did your check cash OK? Your boss told you that funding is the problem. Thats bull. You could throw 10 time the money at state voc rehab and it would still suck because it is designed to suck. Mention VESID to anyone who has dealt with them and their blood will boil.By the way Tim, when was the last time you worked a real job where you had to accomplish something? I’m glad I’m a thorn in your side because VR has been a crown of thorns to most of it’s clients. So keep up the good work and maybe you can think up some more way to justify your phoney baloney job or at least figure out ways to sleep at night. I’d love to do such rewarding work. You’ve heard the joke about the 3 biggest lies. Add this one. We’re from the state and we’re here to help you.

How many Voc Rehab agencies does it take to change a light bulb? answer….. None because according to Tim they can’t afford to, but Ball thinks it’s because they prefer to remain in the dark. After all, that’s where they do their best work.

Right Tim, The politicians, John Q public, and the client himself is the reason voc rehabs suck. The problem is not the tin gods that run the VRs. It’s not the vendors that have contracts with them. It’s not the alphabet soup of agencies that call themselves non profit who hire clever grant writers to scam for money.It’s not the fact that people in the voc rehab feild are clueless automotons who havn’t had a creative thought in their lives. It’s not because these VR folks are too guttless to rock the boat for fear of losing their cushy jobs. Your right Tim and all the people who have been screwed over by voc rehab are just malcontents and malingerers who brought it on themselves. How much does your voc rehab spend per client Tim? I bet that information is not available. How many disabled clients in their catchment area? What is their overall budget? Is this information readily available to the tax payer? I suspect not. I just thought of a place for unemployed VR counselors to work. How about ENRON?!! You can get financial information on corporations as they report to their stock holders. This information is not readily available from government agencies. Seems that stock holders are privy to more information than taxpayers. Let’s see some numbers Tim. Show us how under-funded the VRs really are. ACCOUNTABILITY LET”S SEE SOME!!!

I don’t agree with Tim at all! I gave them information and letters from people and doctors that contested their (VESID) view of my IPE goal. I’ve done research on the Internet and provided it to VESID. I even wrote a 30 page Plan of Action for them. I even spoke with professionals in the field wich supported my plan of action. They still won’t agree to my IPE. After everything that I’ve done on my own. It’s been nearly two years and they’ve not done one thing for me! They’ve stalled on writing my IPE. They won’t answer any questions about the PASS Plan. And the chances are extremely low to get a PASS plan approved if you don’t have an IPE. The last meeting I was treated very badly. All of the meetings are tense, and nothing has come from them, and I will not go to a meeting without a CAP rep. I have a goal that I am serious about, I know what I want to do and I’ve done a lot of research on it. VESID has not given me any explanation on why they don’t like my IPE goal. I’ve done more than enough. I am a level headed person but the meetings are intimidating.
Tim, I just wondering what VESID has done for you. If you had any good experiences, you may be the only one. The negative responses are overwhelming. Experiences like mine makes me wonder. If they really do such a great job why are there advocacies that specialize with VESID?

I think that BALL looses some credibility with his sarcastic comments. There are some legitamate cases I’m sure. But clouding the facts with these sarcastic comments only makes you sound like you’re on the fringe. You seem bitter, and you may have cause, but you come off as malicious. No one’s going to take you seriously and nothing will get done by it.

Ball might be right, it sounds like he’s trying to get a reaction. I’m also from NY and I feel that VR’s either don’t know how to do their job or they don’t want to, because they still get paid for all those meetings that in which nothing happens. Did anyone respond to the questionnaire that was sent out by RCIL?

VR needs some changes. There seems to be no checks and balances. There needs to be more accountability. Accountability for progress and for stagnation in meetings. I think that clients should have more involvement in their IPE goals, and I think that education should be available and readily discussed more by VR counselors. I know they didn’t with me. They seem to be closed minded.

DON”T TRUST C.A.P. (Client Assistance Program) CAP and VESID are kinda like small town lawyers and a judge that go to the same country club. CAP is a federally funded program as is VESID but VESID also recieves state funds as it it part of NYS Education Dept. The commisioner’s name is Stevem P. Mills. Deputy commissioner Lawrence Gloeckler is in charge of VESID. If you can bring an independent advocate with you you’d be better off.A friend or family member with some smarts would be fine. VESID counselors are not the brightest bulbs in the chain. Just stand up to them and if they make a promise get it in writing. Take control of the meeting by asking questions. Also a tape recorder would be a good idea. If they object,tell them you need it as a memory aid. If they object to that turn it on anyway and keep repeating “I need a tape recorder” “Why won’t you let me use it?” “You are violating my civil rights.” The weasel will freak.I’ve done it. People usually won’t challenge there VR counselor for fear of pissing him off and not getting any assistance. They will write lies about you in your file. always get a copy of your file. Document everything. They probably won’t help you no matter what you do. Remember the golden rule: THE GUY WITH THE GOLD RULES. I think they get some perverse pleasure dangling carrots and pulling them away. Don’t assume these people are normal. They are not like most people. They work for the state and don’t live in the real world.

The first thing that needs to be done to reform VR is to cut off their money and starve them out of existence, but the fact that the disabilities has become an unregulated industry with powerful loobying groups that pretend to lobby for the disabled but really lobby for their industry is going to make cutting off “food” to the albatross difficult. The pols are not the problem if you keep in mind that their main job is to keep their job. Often the pols are the collective scape goat for the failing of some poorly run agency. Write to them about the failings of VR and tell them VRs need fixxing before money. They need to be monitored by an entity thats only interest is the disabled. This needs to be done on a federal level, so all states can be on an even playing field. Reward the VRs that do a good job and punish the one that stink. Fear and money are great motivators. Altruism is rarer that rocking horse dung. I’ll shut up for a while. BALL

That’s very funni Ball. “Don’t assume “these” people are normal.” While people are trying to air their concerns and get their advice you’re spouting your own propaganda with these strange analagies. You should write a book. You slam them with so much voraciousness, you sound like a fanatic. It’s like……”The martians are coming, the martians are coming.” With all of that who can possibly hear what the real problem is? I know there’s something wrong with the system. There are proper ways of getting your point across, instead of spinning your wheels. I don’t even know what “they” did that’s got you so mad.

Would a moral person work in a proffession that does more harm than good? Many people think that their dealing with VR did them more harm than good. They usually end up getting jerked around until they get pissed and complain only to get jerked around even more. How many people do you know regardless of their disability that are happy with the way VR has treated them. These people are not normal. Normal people don’t lie like they do. Normal people are usually polite. Normal people have a sense of morality that would prevent them from screwing with people’s lives just to keep their job. Normal people would question the BS that goes on in VR. Normal people wouldn’t last long working at state VR because they couldn’t handle the guilt.

Why don’t they let VR counselors read the newspaper in the morning? If they let them read the paper in the morning they wouldn’t have anything to do in the afternoon.

I have to agree with you about voc-rehab. I applied for services last year. I was told they could not help me, because they were only taking the most severe cases. The irony of this is Voc-Rehab is sponsoring the LD program at the college I hope to attend. The only way to qualify for their servcies is to go through voc-rehab. The system completely STINKS! The university should not even have a program like this in place if it is not going to help ALL ld students. In addition, to suffering through the humilation of giving voc-rehab my personal records my adviser was a total jerk. I asked for my personal records back. He would not return my calls and when he finally did, he made sure to leave a message at the time I told him I was NOT going to be home. As a last straw, I asked my congressman to find out if I could get my personal records back. According to state law those records have to stay with them for auditng purposes for four years. So that means even though these jerks are not going to assist me they have access to my personal records for four years.
I am still searching for a way to get those records cleaned from their files. If anyone has had any success in doing this I would love to hear from them.
My E-mail addresss is : [email protected]

Thanks for listening!