Hello,
I have just recently received scoring from DD’s second private evaluation in two years. We are struggling with a school that sees a child performing for the most part above grade level, but falls apart at home. She is a teacher pleaser, 8 years old in 2nd grade (has an early Sept b-day so missed the cut) in a full Spanish Immersion Program. The only instruction she receives in English at school is 45 minutes a day of English Language Arts and that started in 2nd grade. She was identified for the gifted pull-out, a once weekly 45 minute period based on her Naglieri score @ the 98th percentile.
Originally her IQ was measured @ PIQ 115, VIQ 122, FS IQ 121, with the abbreviated Wechsler in October of 2001. At that time she was also screened for CAPD and ADHD and was given a dx of ADHD/Nos, her VMI at that time was rated at the 2nd percentile. She underwent about 8 months of weekly OT working on sensory, gross and fine motor issues. The psychologist at the time was concerned that there may be an underlying learning disability, however at the time was unable to conduct achievement testing due to insurance prohibitions.
Fast forward -
WISC III
Verbal IQ 119 90%
Perf IQ 104 61%
Full Scale 113 113%
Verbal Comprehension 118 88%
Perceptual Organization 109 73%
Freedom from Distractabilty 112 79%
Processing Speed 91 27%
Subtests
Information 14
Similarities 12
Arithmetic 13
Vocabulary 15
Comprehension 12
Digit Span 11
Picture Completion 9
Picture Arrangement 16
Block Design 12
Object Assembly 8
Coding 8
Symbol Search 8
WJIII Cognitive
Processing Speed 114 82%
Visual matching 108 69%
Decision Speed 117 87%
Retrival Fluency 121 91%
WJIII Achivement
Basic Reading 115 84%
Spelling 108 71%
Editing 96 39%
Puncuation/Caps 104 39%
Math Calcs 98 44%
Calculation 100 51%
Math Fluency 88 22%
Math Reasoning 106 65%
Applied Problems 108 71%
Quantative Concepts 105 63%
Children’s Auditoring Verbal Learning
Immediate Memory Span 115 84%
Level of Learning 101 53%
Interference Trial 116 86%
Immediate recall 72 3%
Delayed Recall 87 19%
Recognition Accuracy 16%
Total Intrusions 16%
WRAML
Story Memory 15 95%
Design Memory 12 75%
Wechsler Individual Written Expression 102 55%
Test of Language Development Primary III
Picture Vocabulary 14 91%
Grammatic Completion 12 75%
VMI now at an astounding 61% for her, which I think has practice effect, she took this in 10/2001, 3/2002 and 12/2002 before this testing in 1/2003.
I have lots of other info, from previous evaluation, but this has gotten very long as it is. My primary questions or concerns are, can anyone tell me if they see a learning disability in these scores? Why did her IQ drop over the last year? Is some of what we see as her weaknesses a result of being tested in English while primarily she is learning in Spanish? Is she gifted/ld? The neuropsych that performed this second round stated that she didn’t necessarily see any specific learning disability, but that DD is slow in processing. She also was tested with the new IVA test for ADHD and neuropsych dx’d her as ADHD/Combined, recommended a 504 with testing acommodations and assistive technology.
I am trying to prepare for requesting a 504 for her, but I am feeling unsettled in my plans of addressing this with the school, as I know I will again see the blank stares regarding a seemingly bright child with learning disabilities.
Sincere thanks for any and all input.
Re: bilingual child/testing help - repost
I am not the test expert around here, so I did’t jump in on that. However I do have a lot of experience in bilingual and immersion education (I’m from Quebec) and I do have a lot of experience with gifted kids. Please ask me any specific how-to questions you may have.
Re: bilingual child/testing help - repost
My primary questions or concerns are, can anyone tell me if they see a learning disability in these scores?
Not necessarily but in conjunction with your description of her, the profile of a child with learning differences does emerge.
Why did her IQ drop over the last year?
It didn’t really drop. It’s the testing process which is ever imperfect.
Is some of what we see as her weaknesses a result of being tested in English while primarily she is learning in Spanish?
Her handwriting issues would not be.
Is she gifted/ld?
Her scores don’t quite suggest that.
I am trying to prepare for requesting a 504 for her, but I am feeling unsettled in my plans of addressing this with the school, as I know I will again see the blank stares regarding a seemingly bright child with learning disabilities.
I’d say a polite ‘too bad’ to them. The law does not say that bright children with learning differences are not covered by the ADA. However bright she may be, the presence of learning differences allows her a 504 or an IEP.
While they look blankly back at you, insist on one.
Good luck.
Witb children who are bilingual an IQ test in one language i
She is learning two different languages and in my opinion she is not LD…The only low scores I can see are processing speed and immediate and delayed recall, and a couple of other related lows which are in areas which require executive functioning in other words are related to ADD….but in regards to the testing to be fair they should be done in both languages to see where she is in acquisition of both of them. This “DROP” in IQ is minimal and is more than likely related to learning two different languages at the same time.
Re: bilingual child/testing help - repost
Again - off the subject of bilingual - but gifted, I just found out that in a neighboring county (which is 1 of the best) my daughter wouldn’t have qualified for gifted. She is gifted perfor, yet not verbal. In that county, you have to be 130 full scale to attend their classes. Of course, if you come in already staffed gifted, they can’t refuse, so she could get in now. She is successful and happy in gifted classes in our county.
Problem is, IF we buy a house we like we may not be able to afford future remediation - which I cannot put myself in that position. “Well, honey, don’t worry about reading - just look at this beautiful house we live in”. The schools are better, but nothing’s better than 1:1 - which we can afford if we stay here and battle the dragons . Maybe I’ll put in a hottub to relieve these tense muscles!
No easy answers, huh?
I don’t know about the bilingual issues.
I will say that most are not very educated about kids who are gifted/LD. Children who are gifted/LD can fall through the cracks because they can compensate to some degree for their deficit. This constant compensation can lead to frustration and burnout. The child could eventually turn off to school.
There is a significant amount of info on the web about this issue.
One place to look is the ERIC data base. This can be found through a search on google.
Also just type the following phrases into google for more info:
Twice exceptional
Gifted Learning disabled
Dual exceptionalities
Some are stuck on the concept that you have to have a high overall IQ to be classified gifted. This is just not true with the gifted/ld population. You have to look at subscores for areas of giftedness. It is important that your child be challenged.
I would also suggest to you that you may need to give up on the hope that this child will be remediated at school. I would suggest that you encourage them to continue to challenge her or her IQ could really drop even further.
You should post specific areas she has difficulty with in order to get remediation for those issues. Schools don’t do to good a job of dealing with core deficits even when those deficits are clearly defined.
Does she have difficulty attending to close work like reading and writing?
Does she have difficulty listening to directions or specific problems with noise?
If you give information about her specific areas that are causing her difficulty at home you might find someone who has experienced something similar.