Extended Time Testing

my child quite easily got extended time (50% more time, not unlimited but plenty for her). All it took was to have extended time for tests requiring reading longer passages as an accomodation on her IEP. The school counselor filled out the form and it was approved by the college board. As far as I know they did not send any results of testing to support the need, other than the IEP. i’m curious though— is the SAT really useful for determining giftedness? I’m really not convinced that we need to be giving 4th graders a test that was designed to predict how well a student will do in college. Our district gives the Naglieri or the WJ III for that age group. Who markets the Explore test?

[quote=”rover”]my child quite easily got extended time (50% more time, not unlimited but plenty for her). [/quote]

That’s all I’m looking for
All it took was to have extended time for tests requiring reading longer passages as an accomodation on her IEP.

My daughter doesn’t have an IEP — the CAPD diagnoses wasn’t considered an LD. She has never been diagnosed as having an LD, although I have never had her tested for LD. In order to get the extended time tests, she will either have to have an LD or ADHD diagnosis.

[quote]The school counselor filled out the form and it was approved by the college board. As far as I know they did not send any results of testing to support the need, other than the IEP. [/quote]
What is your daughter’s dx that qualified her for the IEP?
[quote] i’m curious though— is the SAT really useful for determining giftedness? [/quote]
My daughter has already been tested for gifted using WISC back in 1st grade. That’s not what I’m after here. In order for her to qualify for extended time on SAT in high school, or when offered in 7th grade through Duke TIP or Belin-Blank, she will have to have an established track record/appropriate dx in order to qualify.

[quote]I’m really not convinced that we need to be giving 4th graders a test that was designed to predict how well a student will do in college. [/quote]

— Agreed. I was using the Belin-Blank/Duke TIP invitation for her to take the Explore test (offered by ACT) as a way to test the process of getting extended time testing. It doesn’t matter what she gets on ACT — there is nothing riding on this test, it doesn’t open or close any doors for her.

—It’s an out-of-grade level test to see how a child will achieved compared to other gifted students in her age bracket.

—Last year my daughter took the Explore test without the time accommodation. They gave her a special “stretch her leg” break and let her test in a separate quiet room with a large print booklet. (She has been dxed with a vision issue by a developmental optometrist).

—With these minor accommodations, she scored 18%ile in reading compared to the other gifted 4th graders.

—That, combined with other observations, is what leads me to think that a possible LD may be underlying this. Possibly dyslexia. She compensates because she’s bright, but my feeling is that as she gets older, the gap will widen between potential and achievement. Given enough time to complete the test, the gap might disappear altogether.

[quote]Our district gives the Naglieri or the WJ III for that age group. Who markets the Explore test?[/quote]

ACT.

What I am looking for here is what sorts of LDs will and won’t qualify for extended time testing. A friend of mine said that dyslexia might not qualify. Has anyone else had a problem with that?

I think the fundamental issue is that you have to have an IEP to qualify for extended time testing. This means that she would have to have an LD—and at least where I live in FL, CAPD doesn’t do it. My son had extended time on FCATs but he was classified as having a LD.

Beth

On the form for the College Board. The school Pysch. filled it out as LD with the back-up testing as the WIAT and the WISC and she wrote in the names of the people who adminstered the test.

My son doesn’t need the extra time but will need to do any required essay on the computer. This accommodation requires that the school administer the SAT.

Helen

Hi, Eugenie! It’s great to see you here!

Why won’t you get the private testing (IQ and achievement) and then you have control over whether to share the results with the school or not? If you can see that she would qualify as LD, then you can pursue the LD classification in order to get the testing accommodations. Although, now that I think about it, there must be some way for LD homeschoolers to certify the need for accommodations. I think you should call the College Board. Then tell us the answer!

Janis

it’s not the dx as much as the IEP that dictates— if the IEP team decides that extended time on standardized tests is appropriate, it applies to the SAT as well. i assume you’ve read what info. is avail. on the college board website already. BTW, my child qualified for sped. as LD, “information processing deficit”.

rover, well that’s a new one…that isn’t one of the federal LD classification areas!

Janis

Janis, it’s the terminology used by dept. of defense schools— they use 4 main categories of “impairment”; physical, communication, learning, or emotional— plus developmental delay. “Learning impairment” includes information processing deficit (what is usually labeled LD) and intellectual deficit (mental retardation). Odd, but they don’t fall under the Department of Education either.

Many of the students where I taught got extended time, or the test on tape (but it was the SAT). The person in charge of the task of getting the accommodations, a highly organized and not easily flustered person, found the ever-changing, complex hoops a serious nuisance. However, the most important ingredient has always been having the same accommodations on the IEP for tests at school as the student wants for the SATs.

Eugenie,
A possibility is that she needs more of an accommodation than large print for her vision problems. In particular, the bubble sheets can be very challenging and filling them in can be a real time killer for kids who find them hard to deal with. I think you could get her an accommodation for circling the answers in the test booklet based on the vision problems they have already accepted. It could well be with that with this additional accommodation you will see her completion rate go way up even without additional time. My ds got extended time two years ago and still could not complete most of the subsections. Last year we added circling in the booklet and he finished most everything within the standard test time.

Ahhh, thanks for the clarification Rover! Now I understand, although it is funny that they do their own thing, isn’t it?

Janis

Well this is maybe a bit OT (I’m so good at that), but my nephew took one fo those state tests, wasn’t supposed to but somehow that didn’t get around. He’s severely dyslexic. Anyway, he took the test or rather I should say he filled in the little bubbles. When asked what he was doing, he said “I was making a nice design”! :-)

—des

Hi Janis, Great to see you too. :D

I’m just learning about how to navigate this new discussion board format.
My daughter has already had IQ testing privately — we never had her tested for LDs though because it didn’t seem to me that the school could provide her any reasonable services even if she had an IEP.

For the first time, it is dawning on me that she needs the IEP anyway, whether or not she gets services.

It is clear to me from the other posts here and from what other friends are telling me that without the IEP there is no way she’ll get the time extension on the ACT Explore or future SATs. (This in spite of the fact that she does get time extension on FCAT through her 504 plan based on CAPD, letter from pediatrician, and other documentation).

I formally sent in the packet to the ACT last year and it was rejected.

This past week I have been directing my efforts toward locating a professional in the area that is qualified to do the LD testing (or can put me in touch with someone else who is) and who also knows the ropes for qualifying for an IEP here in our county. I have found a licensed school psychologist who is on Sabbatical at the moment; she is familiar with the IEP regulations and has other associates that can provide additional testing. Moreover, by coincidence, she happens to be the same individual who tested my daughter at age 4 through the Early Intervention program.

The College Board has been only marginally helpful so far. They did send me a list of which specific tests they will and won’t accept, so I sent the list to the school psychologist I am hoping to privately hire. The psychologist seemed to feel that other factors I mentioned will weigh in my daughter’s favor:

(1) the gap between achievement and potential (certain low standardized test scores compared to her high WISC score — more than 2 std deviations different)
(2) the fact that I have been intensively remediating (2 years of NeuroNet and 2 years of private tutoring 2x week, a year of private speech therapy, etc.)
(3) I have collected quite a portfolio of failed math tests and writing samples chock full of spelling errors.

I will keep you posted when we can start the testing and I will certainly let you know if we ever do get the IEP. I am pretty comfortable that if we can qualify for the IEP, getting the time extension from ACT (or SAT) will be MUCH easier, even if we have to retest in High School.

It’s far better to have established a track record in elementary school, though, so I’m glad we’re off to an early start in 5th grade.

To Rover, Beth, and the others who posted — I’m still try to figure out how to answer individual posts — and I’ll try to get back to you individually. In the meanwhile, I want to say I appreciate your help! This is so important to my daughter.

All the best,
Eugenie

Hi, Eugenie! It’s great to see you here!

Why won’t you get the private testing (IQ and achievement) and then you have control over whether to share the results with the school or not? If you can see that she would qualify as LD, then you can pursue the LD classification in order to get the testing accommodations. Although, now that I think about it, there must be some way for LD homeschoolers to certify the need for accommodations. I think you should call the College Board. Then tell us the answer!

Janis

Marie, This is a great suggestion. I’m sure my daughter would have an easier time circling the answer rather than having to transfer answers to a separate sheet. She still needs more time, though.

When given extra time on the FLorida FCAT, she and another boy who were given extra time took more than an extra hour to finish the test. They had to go to lunch and come back and finish the test. They were allowed to take all day if they needed… just not more than a day.

My daughter jumped several hundred points in reading on the Sunshine State portion, bringing her from an average “3” in 3rd grade (with no time extension) to an “above grade” of “4” in 4th grade. On the norm referenced test she ended up scoring in the 95th%ile in both reading and math. Without the extension she probably would have finished less than 2/3s of each test, and therefore would have gotten a far lower score.

I am guessing as the standardized tests get more difficult in the older grades, though, your suggestion of circling the answers will help when even time-and-a-half isn’t enough time to finish the test.

Thanks so much for writing!
Eugenie

[quote=”marie”]Eugenie,
A possibility is that she needs more of an accommodation than large print for her vision problems. In particular, the bubble sheets can be very challenging and filling them in can be a real time killer for kids who find them hard to deal with. I think you could get her an accommodation for circling the answers in the test booklet based on the vision problems they have already accepted. It could well be with that with this additional accommodation you will see her completion rate go way up even without additional time. My ds got extended time two years ago and still could not complete most of the subsections. Last year we added circling in the booklet and he finished most everything within the standard test time.[/quote]

[quote=”des”]Well this is maybe a bit OT (I’m so good at that), but my nephew took one fo those state tests, wasn’t supposed to but somehow that didn’t get around. He’s severely dyslexic. Anyway, he took the test or rather I should say he filled in the little bubbles. When asked what he was doing, he said “I was making a nice design”! :-)

—des[/quote]
Des, you may think this sounds strange, but there is a technical term for what your nephew did: it’s called “Christmas Tree” — my child’s guidance counselor said often kids get so overwhelmed by some of these tests that they just fill out the bubbles to make a nice Christmas tree pattern!

Congratulations on your nephew’s creative spirit!

That he has in abundance!! His wasn’t even a Xmas tree. But it is a good description. I don’ t think he let himself get overwhelmed. He just refused, but instead of a more typical tantrum he did the pattern. I was rather proud of him.

—des

Try www.ets.org/disability/ldpolicy.html#assess
The College Board requires a specific current assessment with subtest scores, diagnosis and documentation of the qualifications of the examiner; the fact that the student has an IEP or 504 plan does not in anyway mandate accomdations on the SAT.

[quote=”SAR”]Try www.ets.org/disability/ldpolicy.html#assess
The College Board requires a specific current assessment with subtest scores, diagnosis and documentation of the qualifications of the examiner; the fact that the student has an IEP or 504 plan does not in anyway mandate accomdations on the SAT.[/quote]

SAR,
You are right… just having the IEP or 504 isn’t enough to get an accommodation. Would you agree, though, that without the IEP it’s hopeless.

My daughter is going to be more of a challenge than most to prove an LD because she is in the gifted program and doing mostly OK in school. That is because I have her tutored twice a week and have intensively remediated at home for years (NeuroNet).

Before I go through the expense and difficulty of getting her tested, I want to be sure it isn’t pointless. It seems, in reading the information on the College Board link you just posted, that getting the accommodation is a difficult-to-impossible task even if she does get an IEP.

However I am going to keep trying.

I think the key is going through the school— the college board lets the school handle a lot of the paperwork and documentation and basically takes their word for it that the testing, etc. has been completed according to their requirements.

[quote=”Rover”]I think the key is going through the school— the college board lets the school handle a lot of the paperwork and documentation and basically takes their word for it that the testing, etc. has been completed according to their requirements.[/quote]
Rover,
This is where we have a catch-22. Our daughter’s school has resisted testing her for LD and giving her an IEP because she’s “not failing enough.” I am afraid I am going to have to get the LD testing privately, bring it to the school, and make sure they give her an IEP (if indeed an LD is found that will qualify). The school psychologist did find more than 3 standard deviations difference between her achievement on certain information processing subtests and potential (on the IQ test) but shrugged it off by saying that the achievement tests don’t go up that high (as the IQ tests do). I don’t know whether to believe him or not. I just assumed they didn’t want to give her an IEP because they didn’t want to have to give her staffing.
It’s all so confusing.

eugenie, your experiences reminds me of what we went through. My child is not gifted— she has struggled since 1st grade. When I requested testing in 3rd grade she did not qualify due to lack of sufficient discrepancy between IQ and achievement. She continued to struggle. With a lot of support from the folks here, I refused to give up as I watched her struggle with school, low self-esteem, and eventually depression by the time she was in the 5th grade. I kept asking the school(by this time we were in a different state) to test again, and they kept refusing saying they “really didn’t think she would qualify”. The fact is (and I learned it here) that kids with certain LD’s often don’t qualify in the early grades because the demands just aren’t that great. When I finally got smart and put my request in writing to the district (mentioning my extreme frustration with the school’s failure to provide an appropriate education and cc’-ing everyone including all of the school board members) I got immediate results. I got a call from the head of sped. who agreed that testing should be done. I truly think they were worried about a lawsuit. If parents request testing, the school must tell them in writing if they refuse, and the reasons. I am sorry that I wasted so much time and energy before I started writing letters.