Son doesn't meet state criteria....

What state are you in and what is the standard for LD services(ie a certain test or scoring 1-2 percentiles below the mean, etc)? What about the category of OHI using the ADD to qualify?

Washington State. They use the Woodcock Johnson and a child must be two below the mean. On paper he doesn’t come close, but in the classroom he is all but non-functional. Dysgraphia is a sure bet but doestn’t play a part in qualifying. ADD diagnosis is a possibility but his executive functioning is above normal and his impulsivity is average so the psych questions it. Otherwise he’s classic. No insurance so I will ask for an independent evaluation but was turned down in Kindergarten so who knows what will happen. Although the Superientendent(s) says I am getting to expensive so it will be considered :lol: My problem is that he has lost another 6 months, is going backwards and his self esteem is plummeting…… Time is short the way I see it.

So, have you tried medication for this ADHD, I mean if you WANT him to be able to concentrate…….

Did you say he WAS in special education before K? Under what handicap?

Is your son on the autism spectrum somewhere, perhaps?

I work with many ADD kids who are just like your son…smart but they can’t pull it together in the classroom.. Do you realize that even though he SEEMS to have executive functioning above average during an assessment, one on one, he is hyperfocusing during the assessment however, that means a hill of beans in a classroom where he can be easily distracted, lose focus and get lost in the shuffle.

I would bet my bottom $$ that he would do much better on meds if you would consider trying them. We paid out of pocket for our son’s medication every month because the insurance wouldn’t cover it. It was worth it when we saw the changes in his reading, writing, etc…he turned around. His handwriting is still atrocious but he can type like a demon… :roll:

Tucker was diagnosed with Developmental verbal Apraxia at 18 months. He didn’t say words till almost 3 and sentences at 4. We signed with him till then. Autism has never been mentioned or have I seen correlation in my research, ideas? Yes I realize that he hyperfocus’s during testing. In fact I asked the psych if he would do all the same testing in the classroom so we could look at those numbers :D Am torn about meds and need to have him seen by a nueropsych before I make that decision. I am sure he is dyslexic (family history and strong academic indicators) and feel a need to clarify what exactly is happening to this boy before we go that route. Medication will not solve the dyslexia issue. I just see this 6 months down the road in the same place and Tucker lost for all intensive purposes.

He may have some motor planning issues with the verbal apraxia, dysgraphia. These type of deficits demonstrate slower motor planning in his brain with synapses occuring slower than normal. This too can be helped with the proper medication.

I have seen kids with severe auditory processing problems/dyslexia and ADD combined, who had years of auditory/LMB therapy and never made a breakthrough until the attention was addressed. I was against meds until I saw how children with this type of comorbidity struggle to master remedial concepts without the proper focus and medication.

The longer parents stall on making decisions (such as a trial of medication); the child, professionals and parents become more frustrated. The child eventually just gives up and tunes out even more because they can’t pull it together no matter how hard they try.

The child isn’t getting it, and it really doesn’t matter what remedial therapy one does if the child can’t focus (meaning we can’t compete with what is going on in their brain) they won’t learn. When they are “tuned in” they learn it, however, if they aren’t tuned in all the time the concepts they know will be scattered and take them forever to master it.

You are the one who has the final say, however, don’t be afraid of doing a trial of medication to get him on the track to success. I have seen medication help kids who have dyslexia which shortens the amount of time spent in remedial therapy. Good luck.

So, since he could read on a 2.9 in K, how do you know he has dyslexia. What are characteristics of autism spectrum I have seen in children at school?

Late and delayed langauge development, strong rote memorization skills with weaker reasoning and analytical skills, motor delays, horrible handwriting…………

But, getting the diagnosis is another story.

Meds. surely might help.

Hi Tink,

I read your post with interest. My school system also tried to pull the wool over my eyes re: specific special ed regs re: qualifying for special ed services - and gave me a lot of misinformation. It seems your school system is doing the same thing to you. Just for grins, I went to the Washington State DOE website, and looked up their special ed regs (I live in Virginia, but went to Washington State University). They asked for a password, but when I clicked “cancel” it took me to the regs.

The link for your state regs (and they are current) is:
http://www.k12.wa.us/SpecialEd/pubdocs/wac/wac_392_172.doc

The information I posted below starts on about page 28 in the regs. It specifically defines how to determine special ed eligibility, and says NOTHING about being 2 standard deviations below the mean on the Woodcock Johnson. The pertinent quotes follow (apologies for the long post, all)

(Look them up, and look specifically at sections 392-172-126, 392-172-130, 392-172-132.)

Your state regs say, “The student does not achieve commensurate with his or her age and ability levels in one or more of the areas listed in subsection (2) of this section, if provided with learning experiences appropriate for the student’s age and ability levels” ABILITY LEVELS is determined by the IQ testing, the WISC in your child’s case.

They then go on to say, “Documentation of the existence of a severe discrepancy between the student’s intellectual ability and academic achievement in one or more of the seven areas specified in this section shall be recorded.” The ACADEMIC ACHIEVEMENT is often determined by the Woodcock Johnson testing.

The SEVERE DISCREPANCY is determined by a regression formula in your state - based on the IQ testing and the educational testing. No where does it say that your child must be two standard deviations below the mean on the Woodcock to receive services. Unfortunately, the state’s table for the regression formula doesn’t seem to be posted. I’m sure you can get it if you call.

Your state regs further say that, “Where the evaluation results do not appear to accurately represent the student’s intellectual ability and where the discrepancy between the student’s intellectual ability and academic achievement does not initially appear to be severe upon application of the discrepancy tables in WAC 392-172-130, the evaluation group, described in WAC 392-172-108 (2)(b), shall apply professional judgment in order to determine the presence of a severe discrepancy. In this event, the group shall document in a written narrative an explanation as to why the student has a severe discrepancy. The written narrative must provide supportive evidence, including the procedures used to determine that a severe discrepancy exists between the student’s intellectual ability and academic achievement.”

So your child doesn’t even have to show a severe discrepancy (if there isn’t one) if the school psychologist and teacher tell the powers that be what they are saying to you, and put it in writing.

Good luck,
Lil

I see several people have brought up the medication suggestion. My daughter also was tested at school by the SLP and found to have severe memory issues and slower processing. She was also tested by a developmental optometrist who found visual processing problems. She had all signs of being dyslexic. We took her for a neurodevelopmental exam and the ad/hd inattentive was found. We’ve tried medication with amazing results. She has gone from remedial reading to grade level, can now remember things like her phone number, can express herself better (apraxia was never an issue), improved handwriting, and hardly any reversals (verbal or written). She was retested by the same optometrist and now does not score as impaired. Instead of being down at 1% she is now in the low to normal range on meds. So, I guess what I’m getting at is that I agree with those who have said that if there are attention issues they may have to be dealt with first. My daughter still gets a lot of extra help but before meds all the extra help was not making the difference it is now.

And my son is on meds, too. But that isn’t the ONLY answer to his educational needs!

Lil

Lil, you are right. In our case, in addition to accommodations in the classroom we are also doing vision therapy, a multisensory remedial reading program at school, and an after school academic enrichment program every day! I don’t know about others but my point was that we were doing these things before meds and they didn’t make that much of a difference. However, I do agree that it is the combination of all of these things that are working for us for right now.

and sometimes it is painful for us as parents to figure out what to do….all we know is we have a child that isn’t learning and losing more ground. It is painful for me to see parents repeating the same mistakes I made… when I refused to listen to teachers/SLP’s who had my child’s best interests at heart and I was in denial about the ADD…I kept thinking…it is just the auditory piece…when in reality ADD was a much bigger part of the puzzle than I ever dreamed….It was indeed a co-morbid muddle that needed to be addressed on all sides with behavior mods, meds, LMB, sound therapy, hearing aids, an auditory trainer, speech therapy, glasses etc….and we are still catching up…but when I look at where we were before meds…we are light years away from that dark period…

Now that I am an SLP I know the frustration an educator feels when you want to help a kid but you can’t because you can’t get them to focus…but there also comes a time when we have to just let go and let them find their own way.

Hey Pattim your still around! I haven’t been on the board for a year or so. Used to be a regular visitor :) Thanks for all the imput everyone. A special thanks to Lil I will research the info. I have had children in Special education for twenty years, the 18 year old has ADD although it was not diagonosed till late and she chose not to take meds. I am not against meds per se and deniel of his ADD is the least of my worries. I was the one insisting it was an issue last year when they told me testing showed it wasn’t of concern.My concerns about medication for this child are real as they should be for any child but all of the questions that I have can be answered with a trail of medication. And I am positive, given the testing that was done recently that he will be diagosed with ADD. This should get him services. I was unaware that medicaton might help his dysgraphia to some degree (his motor planning sucks but only in writing) or that it might help his memory (LT memory 3rd percentile, shST memory 1st percentile). Can any of you fill me in on any medication issues that you had to address? Side effects? Other things to watch for? Thanks again!!! :wink:

Tink,

We found out my 2nd grade son was ADD, LD, and has anixety disorder this past September. At first I was in shock over the ADD as he is not hyper. Then I read about ADD and learned you don’t need to be H to have ADD.

Anyhow, we decided to medicate for the ADD. We thought that if we could get my son to focus, then maybe the extra reading help he was getting would “sink in” faster. He is about a year behind in reading. We also felt that if he was a better reader than his self esteem would improve and maybe he wouldn’t be so anixous. We haven’t started meds for his anixety.

The real problem with meds is the “game.” As not all meds are good for all children. Concerta works great for a lot of ADDers. It’s long lasting so your child doesn’t have to go see a nurse mid-day. Our doctor started my son on that drug. We didnt’ last 2 weeks. It really did help with the ADD, we could tell within an hour of taking the meds. But it really caused his anixety to skyrocket. He cried all day. Not good. So now he is on Strattera. It has been great for him. The problem with Strattera is that is take about 3 - 4 weeks to see if it’s working. But he has been on it since December and although we are still playing with the dose it is helping.

Of course, it doesn’t “cure” ADD/LD/GAD but it is one tool that will help.

You might want to join Chadd. They also have an excellent discussion boards.

ALSO… We are in Florida, but my son was put in the ESE reading program and he has an IEP not so much for his low reading scores, as he wasn’t failing bad enough (like a year behind isn’t bad enough???) but because his IQ was so high, that there was a big difference between his IQ and his reading. He qualified for that.

Good Luck.
Kelly

PS - now that I am done fighting to get him into ESE reading and having an IEP, I am fighting with the ESE department to actually do what they said they would. We did decided to do an intensive reading program (Read America) over Spring Break. A l ot of people on this web site recommended it.

Tink,

Yep, I am still around…I was the one that posted as patti too…You asked about meds…it all depends on the children and their physical make-up…Both of my son’s tried Strattera…That was a nauseating bust for both of them…My 17 year old took a major dive downward when we were trying Strattera. He went through 6 weeks of trying Strattera and then NO meds at all fora month… We let him make that choice….but when he was struggling in his classes and feeling more depressed he went in and talked with the Dr. by himself. They decided to try a low dose of Adderall 5mg…then it went up to 10 mg, for about 6 months then 15 mg for about a year…and he recently went through another growth spurt and his attention was waning again…This time he came up to me and said…I think we need to adjust my meds again…so now he is on 25 mg….He is doing great…He eats like a horse…he is in track…his grades and study habits are doing great again.

His sister is on Concerta…she knew right away when the meds started to work. When she is off her meds she is a chatterbox…goofy and silly…she gets on my nerves which is pretty hard to do… She started on 18 mg and gradually over the past 4 years she has worked up to 54 mg…once a day Concerta. She knows it helps her…she can also tell you when it wears off. She is very active in sports, swimming, water polo…She eats like gangbusters…No anxiety, depression, etc…

Meds have helped my kids realize what they could do instead of barely skating by in school. Now they know the difference between being on and off. :lol:

Good luck with your son. If your daughter is in college she may think about trying meds…my oldest son didn’t try meds until he was 22 years old in college on academic probation due to lack of focus…Now he is doing great!

What city in the State of Washington? If you call our toll-free #888-627-0139, we will be happy to discuss your problems and send you some information. The school district is required by law to provide a second opinion for you and pay for it if you disagree with their diagnosis.

We are based in Tacoma.