I am afraid this is going to be a long one.
I am trying to prepare for an IEP for my 8 y.o. son. He is identified gifted, ADHD and goes to speech. There is something else, I’m not sure what and I think we may need more testing to figure out what it is, but I don’t know what tests. The school isn’t really making any suggestions. I did request an OT evaluation bcause some of his sensory issues are starting to impact him.
So this is a snapshot of him: He is very bright (WISC IQ 149, with some ceilings and some scatter). He is a good reader now, but it came slowly. His comprehension is excellent (stanford 99%) but poor word attack skills (35%). He can’t do phonics. Writing is is worst area. He still does letter/number reversals. He can talk up a storm on any subject but then can’t get anything on paper. A blank page really throws him off. He just sits there says I don’t know what words to use, even after he’s told you the answer. His spelling is at grade level at best, way below what you would expect. He is left handed and forms some of his letter differently. He loves to doodle and draw. He has all the classic ADHD behaviors and then some. He is extremely sensitive to smell, touch, light and sound. Math is a strong area with the concepts, not as strong in arithmetic. He solves problems his own way, in his head, and avoids showing his work. The methods he uses aren’t the way they are taught, but are mathmatically sound.
He is in 3rd grade in a gifted magnet classroom, 3rd/4th split. He is doing 5th grade math. I don’t know what grade level his reading is, but it’s somewhere way above 3rd. His teacher has been great. She thinks his writing difficulties are mostly behaviorial, as there are times when he can just do it (but rarely). I think there is somthing more to it. But I don’t know what. Verbal processing? Expressive written language? Dysgraphia? Dyslexia? Parts of each of these seem to fit, and other parts are really far off. And would knowing a label help or are there things we can work on and/or accomodate for without knowing exactly what it is? I think a label might make it easier for the teachers to accept him. I know the ADHD label has helped with that. Otherwise they would just treat him like a problem-child, now they try to help him.
What tests would help figure this out? Should I request testing from the school? Or take him back to the psychologist who did his IQ? I don’t really have the money for it, but I could scrape it together if I had to.
What questions should I be asking myself and the teachers?
Thanks for any advice or information.
Molly
Gifted Ld
Molly,
I feel like you have just described my son. He is 12 and in 6th grade. He is gifted but also has a memory problem and dysgraphia. We had to pull him from public school after 2nd grade. They didn’t know what to do for him. He went to a neuropsychologist for an evaluation and that is when they found his processing and dysgraphia problems. It isn’t cheap-1300 dollars. Our insurance paid some of it because his diagnosis is ADHD related. We have been trying to figure this problem out since kindergarten and FINALLY have concrete evidence of what I’ve been saying all along. The school system here would not work with us. We have had to do all his testing privately. For a long time they kept saying it was just ADHD but I knew that wasn’t correct. He is great at math concepts and terrible at calculations. He is taking Algebra this yr. and also took it last yr. because he was so bored with general math. The neuropscycologist said that is because he uses a different part of the brain when doing Algebra. If you would like to E mail me that would be fine. Good Luck, Jan
Re: What test?
Janet
I don’t know where to e-mail you.
Now that you have this diagnosis, what do you do with it? Is it just for accomodations? or are there strategies for improving his writing? Certain types of instruction that work for him when others don’t? Is this something he has to learn to cope with or something he can improve?
Thanks, I glad to have found someone who recognizes my boy.
Molly
Re: What test?
Molly,
I have a bright 7.5 yr old that would classify as ADHD if the questionaires are used to diagnose her. She is doing quite well academically and marginally well socially. Her teachers and pediatrician have so far recommended that we just wait and see how things go. I’ve been agreeable to this but I’m wondering if I should have a formal diagnosis made with a neuropsychologist. Several moms on other boards thought that I should find out if she is gifted. She’s already being selected for special enriching programs because her reading level is 2 years above grade level. She hates Math but still manages to get a 3 (grades 1-4) with minimal effort.
Her frustration level is REALLY low. If she doesn’t comprehend something with the first explaination then she starts to cry or throw a small tantrum. This is embarassing for her at school but only seems to happen when she is in one of these special programs for brighter kids. If the work is at grade level she can pick it up very easily and doesn’t get frustrated. She also expects herself to be perfect so anything less than perfect brings out the frustration response. If she is gifted then I’m not sure how the school can work with her immature emotions. Do you have any experience with this?
Terry
Re: What test?
Terry and Mollie, My email is [email protected].
Mollie, When you have dysgraphia there isn’t much you can do to remediate but you can have accomodations that can help you express yourself. We improved his writing with Handwriting without Tears but it still looks like a second grader instead of 6th.We use the computer to do most of his writing now and the Dr. suggested we get Dragon Naturally Speaking software for him. It is a voice recognition program. By documenting his LD he can receive accomodations on SAT and ACT if these accomodations are documented and used before he takes these test. That is the reason I wanted a DX.Because of his slow processing speed he can also be given extra time on test.
Terry, Your daughter sounds a lot like my child in second grade. By the time he would get home everyday he would have a full blown tantrum because of the severe frustration. We finally just took him out of school. If you think she is gifted I would have her privately tested and also look for any LD she might have since gifted/ADHD and LD are common.Also, most ADHD and gifted children are very perfectionistic. They won’t try things until they can be successful. I have seen this over and over in my child’s life (riding a bike, skating, playing board games etc. etc.).Hope this has been helpful. Jan
Re: What test?
Terry,
The first thing I thought of reading what you wrote was something that happened with my oldest son when he was about that age. It was before we had an official gifted label. He didn’t understand something in the homework he was doing, I don’t remember what, something in math I think. And he was just completely freaking out when I tried to explain it to him. We went through this for a week or so with his assignments. He wouldn’t let me help him at all, and was very upset. I finally realized what was causing it. It was the first time he had been given school work that he didn’t already know how to do. I sat him down and explained that he was not supposed to know how to do everything before it was taught to him. I really believe he didn’t know that teachers were supposed to be teaching him. In his 7 year old mind he was a failure because he didn’t automatically know how to do everything.
After I explained that the teachers job was to teach him how, and that it was good that they found something to teach him, he relaxed quite a bit.
We moved him to a different school with tag classrooms for 3rd grade. It was an adjustment at first. The teachers said the first marking period or two would be rough as he adjusted to actually learning and being taught. They were right, but he did adjust and I think it was the best thing we could have done for him. It is not good for children to skate through school with any challenges. The earlier they discover what it feels like to have to work for something the better.
Molly
Re: What test?
Molly or Janet,
Are there any ways to deal with the frustration? We have told my daughter over and over that the teachers are there to teach and she is not suppose to know how to do things before she is taught. We’ve done a 3 deep breath thing with limited success. Do medications help with this? She is not medicated yet.
Terry
Re: What test?
Terry,
For me this occurred with my oldest boy, who is not ADHD. I think for him it was more of perfectionist issue. And perhaps somewhat related to his “reputation” in the school as being smart. At this time, there were kids in his school 4 and 5 grades above him who knew who he was because of his high reading ability. It conflicted with his image of himself, to have something that wasn’t easy as pie.
I don’t have any answers for you on how to overcome it. With us working on the perfectionist issue helped. But I think the biggest help was just time(maturity) and an appropriate classroom placement (tag magnet). I know the gifted teachers worked with him as he was transitioning. But I don’t really know what they said and did.
Molly
Tag?
I’ve never heard of the term tag. Would you mind telling me what it means? Perhaps it’s because my son is in private school.
Thanks
Lori
frustration
Terry, All that helped my son with the frustration was homeschooling. For the first yr. we basically unschooled. By that I mean we did fun educational things instead of classic textbook based ed. We went places and read together about different countries and made food for that country etc. We went to Science Museums and History Museums etc.We did lots of Science experiments and basically stressed the subjects he is gifted in. Jan
Re: What test?
Molly - gifted and dysgraphic runs in my family, me and my daughter both. Yes, it can be remediated, but it takes those three dirty little four-letter words, hard work and time. If you are interested in methods that worked for me, my daughter, and a large number of students whom I teach as a private tutor, just email me and ask for the handwriting stuff.
[email protected]
Check out this forum. Its a really good place to get advice about gt/ld/adhd issues. http://purcell.xc.org/cgi-bin/lyris.pl?enter=gt-special