nitpicking 504 plan

Overall, it may not have matter much if the hyperactivity is included or not in the description of the dx, since most, most people realize that there are differences in the types of ADHD. That said, I think you did a good thing for your dd and others. Now there is no confusion as to the type of ADHD she has, and what her typical symptoms/challenges/obstacles should be. And for those that are ignorant of the types of ADHD, maybe it will inspire them to look it up and find out why hers says ‘inattentive’.

Probably an excellent idea that you did that. It is amazing how one or two tiny words on a transcript can come back and cause trouble years later.

For one example, I took some classes at the local junior college, special ed and reading for ECE. These classes were cross-registered with the university so that teachers could get credit. The ECE students at the junior college didn’t get university-level credit. Well, somebody in the office never noted down that I was university and not college, then the staff changed and nobody has heard of that old program, so now these credits are lost to me forever.

Get it right and no matter what anybody says now about how everybody understands, five years down the road you don’t want a totally new staff pressuring you to use Ritalin because you signed a paper saying your child is hyperactive.

Mostly, I was just amazed that here they are drawing of legal documents and were not able to use the correct medical diagnoses/terminology! It just didn’t make sense. They said it had to match the prescription but it didn’t. But I guess as long as it didn’t match to their specifications it was okay. Not so for me! Another thought I had, right or wrong, was that somebody not knowing my child reading that 504 (like next year’s teacher) may get some preconceived notions regarding her behavior the way it was written. I didn’t want the teachers to see “hyperactive” and think right off the bat—here’s trouble!

Of course the big issue on the plan was the time allowance for homework and that has been taken care of. I was so stressed and frustrated that I almost cried when the supervisor said she’d take care of it and it was a reasonable request.

So, I signed off on the plan today and have it in my possession so now it’s done for sure!

I think that you did the right thing Jen. I’m careful about the battles that I pick and this one would be in the “maybe” file just because the school is looking for any chance to paint parents as unreasonable. You were clearly in the right though. If your child is going to be labeled, it should be the correct label. It’s a no-brainer.

Terry

Absolutely!!! All the way. You did yourself, your child, your district and those who follow a favor. Not to mention those teachers who actually read those records (Tell me there are some, I haven’t met any)

We let something go on our child’s records and it did come back to bite us. If its not important it wouldn’t be necessary for the records, is my view. Get right or don’t include it.

How did the time accomodation for testing go? I nearly choked when you wrote that they would allow it only for teacher written tests. Does that mean your child’s needs are driven by a poor teacher? or by slow processing in the child’s brain? Who thought that one up????

Cheers

mmm, actually I am not only the parent of two children with adhd but also a teacher who reads every 504 or iep several times a year! I make little symbols for me only so I know who needs what. For example a tiny little T next to a student’s name in my book means allow more time! Most teachers I know will read them but it doesn’t mean that they will remember them or follow them!

I like your statement about if it’s important for the records then they should get it right! I’ll have to remember that! I just get annoyed when it can be wrong if it suits them. Also, the feeling I was getting is that it was more of a power struggle then anything else. It’s not like I don’t work in the same system and district. I have plenty of 504 plans in my desk drawer and some of them are much much more detailed and comprehensive than what I was asking for. My daughter’s school said they never heard of the accommodations I have for my students and said something to the effect that maybe it’s because it’s high school. You’d think a different school was a different country!

Like Terry (I think) said I’ve kind of picked my battles on this one. I need to take a wait and see attitude because they are revising the curriculum next year. Here’s what we came up with. All kinds of testing accommodations for standardized/state testing. Separate room, more time, questions read if needed, etc. Then it says extra time for CERTAIN assignments and if she doesn’t finish her school seat work she can finish at home. The dr really wanted the time restriction removed overall. Not only because of the adhd but also because of the anxiety issues. They said they can’t give more time on classroom testing because of something called district benchmarks. They don’t know how many benchmarks there will be next year. When they know then I will know what I need to do. They said they can’t change the chapter tests in textbooks by allowing more time because that is clearly a modification of the curriculum and I quote “if she is that disabled she needs an iep.” I disagree totally with the logic here but took some time to think about it. Really this year the big thing she really has needed more time with is homework. This has been on nights that she went to vision therapy of had a doctor’s appointment. When it gets late and she’s tired it’s a real struggle to have her focus on anything. Part of it is a medication issue and part of it is that’s just how it is with any child but more so with a child who has adhd. The school was the one that “HIGHLY recommended” she be in the after school academic program for extra help. I am home after school so I don’t need child care. I certainly discussed it at length with her teacher before I allowed her to be in school until 5:30 four days a week! It’s a long day for anybody! So, all that I asked for is a statement in the section of the 504 where you can put personalized notes that on occasion she may need an extra day for homework. So, that’s what the problem was. At the end the principal agreed because the district supervisor directed them to put it in but only on the condition it said “on the rare occasion.” I don’t think they expected I would fight it because most people probably don’t. But I think this was the most angry I have ever been at any school! It came across as a power struggle and that the didn’t want to “give” too much! It certainly wasn’t being fought out by people who really understand adhd and some of the difficulties our children face!

Sorry, if I went on too long! I am very happy with what we ended up with and do feel really good that I was able to make a change for the entire distsrict (about 10,000 students). It feels much more respectful of the people (students and family) living with adhd to acknowledge the correct terminology. Not like, Oh we can call it that because it really doesn’t matter it’s all the same anyway—like one of them told me, well, you know the name adhd is really only a big umbrella for all sorts of things anyway!

Jen, I had a feeling that my post would be confusing. Your concern would be in my “maybe” file not because it is not valid just because we have trouble getting the most basic, obvious needs met. It wears them out agreeing to the most modest requests. Asking them to be organized and accurate on paper is met with great opposition and ruffled feathers. Why they have set the bar so low for themselves I do not know. Your administrators should be embarrassed to label a child incorrectly. I don’t know about you but we are not dealing with rational or fair people all the time. They are far from professional and that is why they are so defensive.

Terry

Terry, you are so right and that is part of why it can be so frustrating!

Hi Jen,
We just had our Special Ed/504 meeting for my child that has rheumatoid arthritis and OCD. She has a Preschool IEP and we had to force the school to even agree to a 504. Special Ed was ruled out for totally bogus reasons. There are 30 lawsuits in our district right now and you know what a dead-end that is so it must be pretty bad. They wanted us to sign that we agreed to the 504 plan at the conclusion of the meeting and the actual plan won’t even be written out for us for a few weeks. We had an advocate there that gave them heck over legal issues but in the end we would have to get a lawyer to accomplish all our objectives and it wouldn’t be worth the fallout. Every bit of written information out of the Director of Education’s office has been flawed. For example, we were demoted out of Special Education based on assessments that were stated to have been done but were actually never done. They stated that an expected absentee rate of 26% can’t be used as access to education issue because my daughter is so bright. Uh excuse me Ms A, aren’t smart kids required to go to school. It has been just pathetic. I feel so sorry for some of these administrators because they are just so stupid. Almost every word spoken sounds dumb and they have all the power. How many corrections can you bring up without making them look really bad and you know what that gets you….

The teachers and PT’s at the meeting were excellent however. They are on the front lines and generally are in teaching for good reasons. They bent over backwards with accommodations and suggestions.

I know this is not a child with ADHD but I know that you all can relate. I haven’t even identified my daughter that has ADHD. I just talk to each new teacher and that is that. Good news for her today. Nice Standardized Test Results so she will be able to get out of class every now and then for enrichment. Boredom brings out the hyperactivity something awful.

Terry

Terry, how did it all work out with your daughter’s 504 plan? Do you mean they wanted you to sign that you agreed to the accommodations before they actually wrote it? Sorry, after being away all summer I’m still getting caught up on reading various boards!

I took my daughter to meet her teacher before school started. All of her anxieties had kicked in so it was a must. I asked the teacher if she had received the plan yet. She said that she had not but was notified she had one. I just happened to have a copy in my hand for her! The teacher glanced at it briefly and noticed the preferential seating accommodation and said right away she’ll move my daughter’s seat! Such a little thing but so important to start out the year sitting in the right place! I know here at my school it sometimes takes a few weeks before I’m given the 504 plans. In fact, just got an iep today!

Hi Jen,
This is really sad. The administrator that handles the 504 plans said she’d be “working on the plan” but it never happened. She caught me in the hall at school, shoved her little appointment book in my face and said that we need to set up an apt. to discuss if R even needed a 504 or not. This totally floored me. With only the words “you liar” in my head, I blurted out that I had to talk to my husband about it. He’s too angry to meet with this woman so we’re just laying low right now and trying to figure out how to deal with this. The good news is that all the teachers and aids have been accommodating my daughter unofficially.

I won’t be looking for a 504 for my ADHD daughter. We have just begun the neuropsych. eval from an outside provider. K’s grades are good and she doesn’t bother anyone else so the school would not be interested in doing their “Wal*Mart brand” evaluation. I’m thinking that we have given every tool that there is to compensate for her ADHD and she is not doing well in 3rd grade. The extra homework and a teacher that was too hard on her for not “listening” or “transitioning fast enough” nearly put her over the edge. The teacher has backed off but I’m seeing the writing on the wall. Homework is a real struggle. I have to be on her all the time for emotional support or prodding. Fits of frustration are almost daily. It’s a drag. I’d be willing to consider meds at this time but maybe the psychologist will come up with some additional ADHD tips.

Thanks for asking,
Terry

Terry, I typed out a longer response to you earlier but I got busy and the computer timed out on me!

Basically, we didn’t have a 504 plan for last year (1st grade) for the same reasons you mention. The teachers were making all of the accommodations already. However, this year starts standardized testing so it’s more of a factor. If the teachers are doing everything and your daughter is doing well it means you have time to work on getting exactly what you want! I know it is so frustrating that something so easy becomes so difficult! After last year I learned to never trust the schools to do anything without checking up on things! The teachers were great but getting that 504 plan in place was like pulling teeth and then some!

I understand where you are with your adhd child. I will never forget the meltdowns and screaming that ended with me holding my daughter as she sobbed because she didn’t know what was wrong with her and thought she’d never learn to read! Things have been so much better since learning about adhd and treating it. For us medication has been a tremendous help. My daughter was already getting special help in school, staying after school for tutoring help, and going to vision therapy and still extremely frustrated.

As a parent and educator, I really do think it’s best to get a private evaluation if you can. I didn’t use the schools mostly because of the time factor. By the time they would have gotten around to my daughter she would have been even further behind. Also, I didn’t totally trust them to give us a correct diagnoses. Whatever happens things will have to get better for your daughter as a result of the neuropsych evaluation. Like you said, maybe even some new strategies may be helpful. Good luck and hang in there!

Jen,

I am now convinced that I will never get a 504 for either of my kids, one with rheumatoid arthritis and one with ADHD. I’ve talked with so many parents and apparently the school bends over backwards to please parents in an unofficial sense to avoid legal identification. I don’t know why they ignore medical confidentiality issues to do this because they have meetings with all the teachers that my kids come in contact with and discuss their “issues”. I personally don’t mind this but I would think that that would open them up to a lawsuit. I would think that limiting 504’s would tic off parent so badly that they’d have more lawsuits. There are currently 30 active lawsuits in our district now. I can’t imagine suing because I would feel that I would automatically have to leave the school. I would rather just leave the school up front and save the litigation costs if things don’t go well for my child. The sad thing is that I think that the kids go the “unofficial route” and have a greater risk of something bad happening because there is no “in-writing” plan. I like the 504 for the framework that it creates to assure accommodations. I actually do understand their fear about 504’s because I suppose it can sometimes result in rediculous accommodations that are nearly impossible for the school to provide and then when they don’t, WHAM, the parent is irate and a big confrontation results. ALL I CARE ABOUT IS MY KIDS. They don’t care about lawyers and other adult issues. I think we’re just going to have to go “naked” without the 504’s and hope that all goes well. I end up writing to 4 different teachers, talking to the bus driver, and helping my kids to self-advocate. There is not much more that I can do short of pulling my kids out.
Terry

Maybe if they are bending over backwards that is enough, whatever their motives are. I have had IEPs for my child and had them be wonderful on paper but useless in practice. So legal protection in principle doesn’t always mean legal protection in reality. Now I have my son in a parochial school where public school protections aren’t in place. They knew he was LD coming in and I was upfront about what he would need to be successful. I have had wonderful luck with teachers (there are two for each grade and I have allowed the asst. principal to decide which is best for him). I basically negotiate what my child needs. Both years (this is the second one) I have been offerred accomodations that I don’t think my child needs and I have turned them down.

I once thought about legal action at the worst of it all in the public schools and decided my time and money would be better off spent directly on my child.

Beth

Thanks guys. I generally get the advice to go for the 504 but there is not much that you can do without a lawyer if they saw NO.
Terry