Younger sibling able to be in gifted program? Good, bad?

Here’s my take (worth its price; if it doesn’t make sense, take it to the return counter :-))Don’t hold back one child “for the good of” the others; you’ll be second guessing yourself FOREVER.
Do work harder at valuing the gifts and contributions of all the kiddos. Be sure you are valuing *effort* more than gifts - let’s face it, in the long run, self discipline and character are more important. (By the way, it’s a lot harder to develop self-discipline if you never have to try.) If the gifted program is the best way to let the middle kiddo use his gifts - it’s NOT becuase he’s better than the other two; he didn’t do anything to get those gifts - then do it… and be sure to look for opportunities to develop gifts in the other guys.

First, I really don’t think it is fair to base a decision on whether to place your second son in a gifted program on whether his older brother will feel bad. You need to instill in your children that they are individuals and that you will do what you need to do to meet all of their needs. That, of course, doesn’t mean that your older child won’t feel bad if he compares himself but he is likely to feel bad rif he compares himself regardless of whether your second child remains in a regular classroom or is in a gifted program.

As far as whether to put your son in the gifted program, gifted programs differ around the country. Where I am at a child has to test as having a 130 IQ or above to qualify. Achievement scores are irrelvant. My kids are not gifted but I have friends whose children are. They have been mostly happy with the programs. One child was a trouble maker in the regular classroom and is much better behaved when challenged.

That said, your son’s achievement scores are lower than would be expected from a child with 130 IQ, if that is the criteria they are using. Your child’s achievement scores are in the top quartile but not in the top 1 or 2%. If they are using achievement scores, then I would guess this is more of a tracking—higher achievement but not “gifted” kids together, regardless of what they call it. This is done where I am at as well, especially at the middle school and above levels. I also have a friend whose child is in a higher achievement class. These kids do not test as gifted on IQ tests but have well above average test scores on achievement tests (FCATS in Florida where I live). While the gifted placements are visible to all, this higher achievement class placement is looks just like any other class placement. It reflects the administration’s decision of how to group kids in classrooms. We have very large public elementary schools (over 1500 kids K-5) so there are lots of ways kids can be grouped into classrooms, even without being labeled gifted.

I guess I would make sure I understand the criteria they are using, what the class composition will be like in terms of skills and abilities, and exactly what the teaching looks like. Also, how happy are you and he with what he is currently getting in the regular classroom? It sounds like you took the initiative to have him tested. There must have been a reason.

Beth

Agree with the other posters.

Are you aware that convergence problems respond to vision therapy? A relatively inexpensive way to address convergence problems is with computer software. In most areas, the pre-testing, software, and post-testing cost under $300. You can find developmental optometrists licensed to dispense this software at http://www.homevisiontherapy.com

A program such as BrainSkills is likely to be very helpful for your 12yo also. This program works on processing speed, among other things. The program does require commitment — a minimum of one hour per day working one-on-one with the child doing the exercises — but summer is an excellent time to do it. Most children start showing significant gains after about 40 to 50 hours of training. Website for that program is http://www.brainskills.com

It seems to me that, if you can help the 12yo and younger child, the excelling child would be helped a great deal also.

Nancy

Agree with the other posters — do NOT hold one child back out of guilt towards the others. That will not make anyone happy. Besides, all your kids are getting special help — some for vision therapy, some for reading, and so on. So if this one goes into a different class, well that just fits in with all the rest.
Do see what you can do about the vision therapy etc.

Thanks for all your input. I asked this question here because of all the “peer” pressure I’m getting from the women around me. We live in the boundaries of the school that has the accelerated program and there are very strong opinions on both sides of the fence. Given the limited number of accelerated classes and the small size of the schools parents who put their children in the accelerated programs are viewed as “pushy”. So, I knew that you would give me an unbiased opinion given you don’t have a stake in the game here.

I’m just trying to do what is best for my children and I know what is best for one obviously isn’t best for another. You also have or work with children like mine and sometimes its reasurring to talk to someone who is familiar with the struggles we go through. We’ve spent so many hours and so much money helping our oldest son achieve and use his gifts that I feel like if we don’t help our second son by putting him in the accelereated program we will be doing him a disservice. Unfortunately, I will be seen as a pushy parent because I put him there. But, it is indeed a gift of his and I feel and we need to nourish it. Oh well, I’ve also been told I was crazy for taking my oldest to vision therapy. That by the school psychologist.

Beth,

I misspoke. I said the program was gifted and I found out since that is is an accelerated learning program. His THIRD grade ITBS (Iowa Test of Basic Skills) placed him in the 99th percentile in FACTS for everything but language and social studies. In those he was still above 90. And the SAT for 4th grade placed him in the 87th percentile for reading and 79th percentile for language and math. I’m guessing that means compared to other 4th graders (although he is only in third) he is in these percentiles. I found out we don’t really have “gifted” programs in public school here, just accelereated learning. Accelerated learning means not as much repetition and they only accelerate reading and math.

Our schools vary in size depending on where you live. And, there are very limited number of schools in our district that have these accelerated programs. Next year it will be 7 schools out of 55 that offer these programs and only 1 or 2 classes per grade per school. So, competition for spots in them is pretty stiff.

Why did I have him tested? Not just because of his test scores but because of things that occur at home. I have to tell him not to answer questions for his sixth grade brother or he will just tell us the answer within a matter of seconds. His ability to do “mental math” is amazing and his reading and comprehension is above that of other third grade students in our schools. At the beginning of the year they gave the students a spelling test for all the words they were expected to learn to spell by the end of the year. He missed three. So, he was basically done with third grade spelling and the year hadn’t even started. School doesn’t stretch him. He coasts. I want him to know what it feels like to have to work to achieve. He hasn’t had to experience this in school yet. Maybe, education will come easy for him even in the accelerated program but I want to give him all the opportunity for growth that I can.

Nancy,

Thanks to this forum I’m aware that the vision problems can be corrected through vision therapy. We’ve been going to vision therapy and are working to fix the convergence problem. The convergence problem is the last one left. Given the expense we only go once a month now but the vision therapist gives us exercises to do at home. We used to go every two weeks but the firm she works for was acquired by the local university here and her hourly rate went up over 35 dollars. She said she had no say in the price she now charges. So, she works with us by giving us homework. I know she would prefer he come in more but we just can’t afford it. He also works better for her than for me.

We’ve done PACE and Master The Code. (Wow, was it expensive here. More per hour than vision therapy. I think they can get away with it because as far I as know they are the only ones providing it locally.) Do you still think brainskills would be useful? PACE and Master The Code seemed to help quite a bit. Our 12 yo is reading now and his spelling has improved some but we need to work on it and fluency. I’ve thought of doing Reading Rewards this summer after we get the convergence issues resolved. You also mentioned AVKO for spelling and I think abcdarian. I’ll have to look at my notes.

Thanks for all your input and support. I truly appreciate your taking the time to help me. You’ve been life savers. It is through this forum that I’ve learned about all the programs we’ve tried. I only hope I can provide the same for other parents looking for answers.

Maja,

Your son clearly belongs in the accelerated classes. It is true that some parents are “pushy” and think their children are brillant and deserve everything. Don’t let such attitudes (and others steroetypes of the type of people who have their kids in accelerated classes) keep you from doing the best for each of your children. You have done what you have needed to do for your oldest and he has benefited. Your second child deserves the same treatment.

Beth

Wow! You’ve done a lot for your 12yo!

If he’s done PACE and MTC, then BrainSkills probably isn’t going to be worth doing. It is just the home version of PACE.

I do think, though, that the Rewards reading program is well worth doing over the summer. The original program is the best if your son reads on a beginning 4th grade level or better. If it’s 2nd or 3rd grade level, the Intermediate version would be better. You will find Rewards much less work than PACE/MTC!

AaBbCcDarian is for beginning readers, and your 12yo would be past it if he has done MTC.

Nancy