I think my daughter may have a learning dissability

Hi Mandi again, yes you could be right about the stress, depression and anxiety not being genetic but the learning disability is genetic which a lot of learning disabilities have low self esteem, depression etc so it could be that we are dyslexic but not severe but have the low self esteem etc to go with it. Do you have issues with any of this? Sharon x

Some LDs very well may be physical in nature. I can say ADHD is a disorder that has not been proven through hard science to be any such thing. As for duyslexia, i do believe they have provided physical components for that. Therefore, it is a very real thing. As i do believe there is some physical evidence for it that science can verify in phuysical reality. That is the difference between a disease or true defect and made up mumbo jumbo by the pharmaceutical industry to make money. Physical proof of a problem.

I am dyslexic. It was really hard when i was young because i was a rather moderate to severe case. I still have some minor trouble with it to this day. But i have found ways and have been taught methods to compensate for most of the issues it caused. However, realizing you are a little different when young is always tough. Especially when people treat you differently or like you are ill. Others all of society picks up on that. YHou can’t tell i am dyslexic when i am a stranger walking down the street. But you can tell when you see my hand writing. It is difficult and torturous and depressing to feel one’s self judged not so much for something one has no control over, but based on the appearance of a written word rather than for the content of what it is you are writing.

I study ancient egypt. I find certain things fascinating about that culture. Not just their insane sexual practices and their mythology, but just how they wrote the hieroglyphs. I would have had no trouble as a dyslexic in ancient egyptian society. Because there is was no right or wrong way to write a hieroglyph. So long as you drew the pictograph correctly it didn’t matter which way the words were written or which direction the pictographic characters were pointing. Alot of this is that society has made these super tight little margins and allows for absolutely no deviation. So again. i think part of the problem lies with society. But i do recognize that they do offer physical proof for dyslexia to substantiate that it exists and can and does cause difficulty. The result of which can be children’s brains develop chemical depression as a result of the way they are treated due to such minor learning issues. But that same study also proves too it ccovered depression as well and the conclusion in that study and again let me make this clear one study a scientific suggestion makes. One study a conclusive scientific fact does not make. Not until it is verified by a bunch of other studies. Also recent studies are showing the rate of depression in children who suffere3d abuse as children is and was alot higher even when they reached adulthood. I think these experiences can trigger with constant repetition brain issues such as chemical changes that otherwise wouldn’t exist. That also goes for children with developing brains being mistreated frusterated much too often or just feeling dumb seeing others do so easily what their own brain can not do. Bujt the depression is an entirely separate matter from the LD, though often one is fed by the other and by the way society family and the education system treats someone with an LD.

You just said 2 things that were really interesting.

“Which the lady at the parenting group said that anxiety tends to run in families so looks like they get it from me…… ” is the first interesting statement. The reason it is interesting is because this is what i used to call nonsense and now call nonscience.

The human brain as part of the human body is a mater of DNA. We inherite certain traits and even certain talents from our ancestors. That is an undenyable fact.

For many years they have been thumping this card. Yet just like with ADHD, they can not even point to one half of the genome or the other as to where exactly the problem for this anxiety or depression is found int he DNA. They have not isolated anything that indicates that parrents pass on anxiety or depression to children in their DNA. I am not saying that they don’t. I am saying until they offer physical evidence they need to shut up.

A recent study that was done shows that actually, mood disorders such as anxiety and deprtession are NOT genetically passed on and are instead passed on through nurture rather than nature. This is only the first really good test of this kind that has been done. But it was printed in a peer reviewed journal. Which means the hard science is saying this genetic pass on of anxiety and depression likely doesn’t account for most of or all of the passing on of these mood disorders we are seeing. Let me be very clear. Unlike them, i don’t believe in misleading anyone. This is 1 study. It is not yet scientific fact as it is 1 unrepeated study. But it does raise the suggestion and merely the suggestion that what we have all been told about mood disorders like anxiety and many forms of depression anyway are actually solely or predominantly the product of nurture and not nature. The suggestion this paper establishes, is that your behavior and way of interacting with and around your children is the cause of this and the way you view it and handle it is the cause of this rather than your genetic contribution to your children.

The next interesting thing you say is,

“So it may be that stress/depression is not accepted in our family and that is why we deny it.”

Interesting isn’t it that your family handled this much the way you are and they passed it on to yourself and to your sister. Though it may be visible somewhat differently in her and in you it is still the same… thing. Seems to me you learned to be this way as a child. Seems you are inadvertently teaching it to your children. Because the problem was gifted to you much as you are gifting it to them. It is a form of psychological abuse. The thing is, not everyone who abuses knows theya re. And many don’t realize it ever and many never make the effort to stop and to get the help that is needed. You are dealing with getting the help in part for the wrong person/s. Your children have these problems likely as that paper suggests because you taught them to have it. The more of this they see and take part in the worse it will effect the rest of their lives. But you are a good parent. You are trying to get help. You just are so ashamed because some part of you knows you are on some level atleast to some degree a contributor to the problem with your own behavior and way of dealing. Now they need help also. You are right. But you can get them help till the sky turns orange. It won’t do much good until you seek not only support for yourself but corrective behavior therapy for yourself as well and put those changes into effect. And it is hard to admit something like that to yourself or to others. But i think, to have survived what you have, that you are made from stronger stuff. You need to teach your children they are also. So you tell that woman it was your parenting and your issues and not your genetics because she can’t point to a thing to prove otherwise. And the scientific study that is most recent int he peer review journal on this one is in favor of you got it nurture and not nature. They want to believe it is genetic. And they could be right. But they need to stop terrorizing parents they are supposed to be trying to help with such untrue statements. If they want to say, “We can point to nothing in the genome that supports this but we tend to believe eventually we will possibly find something to back this up, we believe these behavioral and mood traits are genetic.” I will shut my face and say nothing because that is honest. And it is the cold truth. But so long as they make these suggestions based ona dubious lack of evidence…. I will refute the claims because the evidence collected tells us something entirely different.

So you hang in there and be strong.

Hi thank you Mandi i have noticed a lot of the things you put in your post, this time last year i was extremely stressed because there were a lot of changes job, partner and car yes you wouldn’t think that would not upset me but it did all the same, the car i had for 7yrs so a long time i had become quite attached to it it was 16yrs old and hadn’t cost me much and was reliable but it did need the locks doing, my partner and i had run our course and of course being together for 17yrs is a long time so a big change and my job had been doing a lot of changes and i got to the stage where i was so stressed with everything else going on i had a break down and it affected me in the way that i was mental literally, i was counting in fours everything, colour coordinating pegs and clothes, tapping clicking and making funny noises, constantly talking to myself but loudly without realising. And i didn’t realise how bad i was but looking back it wasn’t good then having to cope with the children that have their own difficulties, my youngest is showing a lot of ocd habits and she screams a lot and tip toes and flaps hands a lot as well, so i have to be on the ball to cope with it all. I also have anxiety attacks especially when out of my comfort zone and with people. Which the lady at the parenting group said that anxiety tends to run in families so looks like they get it from me……

But funny when the psychologist asked me if their were any mental illness in the family i didn’t admit it, also when i went to see a coucillar i played down all my stresses as if i wasn’t too bad. It is like i don’t want to admit anything is wrong and everything is ok but yet i know it isn’t right. My sister is on betablockers due to stress although she won’t admit she is stressed she said she is fine but her body is telling her differently, high bp, head aches to the extreme where she ends up in hospital. So it may be that stress/depression is not accepted in our family and that is why we deny it.

The positive praise is so working she loves it and so does my youngest and funnily enough it works on my eldest two and their friends, you should see their faces as they aren’t used to it, even the friends. Thanks again i feel 100% better than what i did feel, and coping better and it shows on the children, you are so right about the way parents are and children. Thanks again Mandi you have been a great support. Sharon x

I’d take her to get a complete set of tests done to see if you can figure out what kind of therapies or treatments she may need. It sounds like she’s a pretty complicated kid with several things going on. The speech issues, sensory issues, difficulty with change, impulsivity, hyperactivity and learning issues can be symptoms of several things so its important to get a professional evaluation.

Hi thank you for the reply i forgot to mention that she as been also seen by a psychologist but she put it down to me and her dad splitting up and put me on a parenting course which will help to control some of the behaviour but won’t stop it she can be hard work as she expresses her emotions tantrums rather than explaining what is wrong with her so obviously stresses me out before we get down to the bottom of things. She as also recently been diagnosed with reflux by a barium meal, she has been doing the behaviours since she was about 1yr old so it hasn’t happened overnight, i think they want to just fob me off, at the time i was also stressed due to us splitting up so i was weak and took what was said, but i am composing myself ready to fight next time, the parenting course starts in autumn. Sharon x

She needs to be seen by people who understand brain disorders and learning disabilities, not by a psychologist. A Neuropsychologist is someone who understands brain disorders and learning. Testing by this professional can help sort out what her difficulties with learning are and may give you a clearer picture on the behaviors. An Occupational/Physical Therapist can help with the sensory issues and develop therapies to help her not be so reactive to things like clothing and sounds. An Audiologist can help with discovering if she has an auditory processing problem which can make it difficult for her to understand what people are saying, especially in crowded places such as a classroom. An Educational Optometrist will look for difficulties with visual perception and how the eyes are working together. Problems in this area can make it difficult to see things clearly, even close up. You may also want to add a Urologist to see if the bed wetting has a physical source.

My daughter is a complicated kid. :) She has Dyslexia, Dysgraphia, Dyscalculia, Auditory Processing Disorder, Sensory Integration Disorder and Irlen Syndrome. On top of that she sees a psychiatrist for Bipolar and Anxiety Disorders. We’ve been able to find various therapies, interventions, accommodations and modifications for her over the years. This will be her Senior year at school. She loves math, reads at grade level, uses a computer for writing and can tolerate a lot more than when she was younger. We never would have gotten this far if we had not insisted on getting the thorough testing by various professionals. The school was just ready to write it off as problems stemming from her bipolar and anxiety. With the information we gathered we’ve been able to really help her in all the areas she needs help in.

Hope this helps to clarify some.

Thankyou scifinut, i was speaking to a friend of mine last night that also struggled to get her son diagnosed it took her until he was 10yrs old and also the teachers saying that nothing is wrong although he was starting to cause scenes in the class room due to frustration and when he was diagnosed the teachers were like well i didn’t think he had it as he isn’t hyper as he was diagnosed with adhd he was also diagnosed with mild learning difficulties so she has also had a fight on her hands. Another friend of mine her daughter who is 4 is also on a diagnosis for adhd and she did similar things to Melissa other than she was forward in speech and potty training, they turned down the parenting class saying that she doesn’t need it that it is something wrong with her but she had her partner the childs dad stand by her my ex my daughters dad is burying his head and saying nothing wrong with her and that she will come on at school doesn’t see her anxiety as a problem, he is in denial, her favourite toys are dinosaurs, she reanacts scenes out of films with her toys, she as a big interest in aeroplanes we visit airport regularly as we live near one.

My older daughter who is 14yrs old next month as had sensory issues for a long time, she now cuts labels out as to wear certain shoes and socks but doesn’t like change, does little eye contact and is very eccentric she is gifted in art she will draw for hours and hours on end doesn’t socialise much like you would think teenagers would, she is happy to sit by herself with music on drawing, i want her to go to art college, she is also immature in her age, she can also be clumsy and her stance the way she walks looks clumsy hard to describe. My son as anger issues and also did a lot of autistic behaviours when younger like lining up cars and obsessions and wasn’t social but i knew nothing then as i was young and naive i remember the teacher saying something and i said so what he likes his own company what is wrong with that, he had depression episodes and was also anxious he was put on a programme for kids that were struggling he is also colour blind, my younger daughter at the moment uses left hand for everything but does switch now and again but is mainly left handed, i know there behaviours are not normal or not to the extent they are doing it, my younger daughter is not getting the fact that you don’t go around hitting kids or pushing them but she is only 2 so i am hoping she will grow out of it and her speech isn’t too good also but she lost speech around the time she had mmr but i am allergic to something used in injections as i have been tested she knew 10words then lost them at 14mths but then regained them at 2yrs old she is now 2 and half, she is very aggressive but also very hyper, i am just going to keep an eye on her but i am pushing for speech therapy which i regret not doing for my other daughter who struggled and still has immature speech. Thank you again for the reply. Sharon x

when he was diagnosed the teachers were like well i didn’t think he had it as he isn’t hyper as he was diagnosed with adhd he was also diagnosed with mild learning difficulties

First of all i need to say something here because i don’t think this poster understands the test for ADHD at all. It is entirely subjective. You can go see one doctor tomorrow and fill out a questionare (yes a questionare is the extent testing for ADHD.) About behaviors which everyone displays to varying desgrees. Sometimes they meet with the child sometimes they don’t even bother. There is no medically relevant anything that goes into the test it is solely a matter of analyzing the behavior. It is diagnosed on the sole criteria of meeting a certain number of the symptoms (way less than half of them) which againw e all display, (again to remind you sometimes they don’t ever even see the child they are diagnosing to make the diagnosis according to procedure it isn’t necesary.Though usually they do.)

There is nothing scientifically credible or verifiable in this sort of a test. Today there are 3 types of ADHD and one variety is the variety that doesn’t really exhibite the symptoms which is just hysterical as the symptoms are the only thing they are using to justify the diagnosis.So if he doesn’t behave like he has it and meet that certain number of symptoms then he can’t have it or atleast they should not be saying he does as that is all it is a person perceiving another person’s behaviors in as negative a light as possible and then lableing them for proffit. There is no organic evidence of any kind for ADHD. The man who named it in 1980 says it is over diagnosed in over 30% of cases and over medicated in something like roughly 60% of cases that ocurre in the USA. According to the text book on methodology, ADHD is the diagnosis for a child any time a parent is upset or annoyed by their kid. It has actually nothing to do with the child’s behavior then in reality and has more to do with the parents. I just wanted to clarify that as there are many people in the scientific community who consider ADHD a fraud. Including Dr. Breggin and Dr. Baughman and quite a few others. Even Nimh is getting money from the pharmaceutical companies and groups like CHADD And pretty much many and most doctors get a small check or speaking engagement fee or something free vacation for every child they put on a drug, so now we have a bunch of kids that don’t exhibite the symptoms of ADHD on drugs like ritalin which is just legalize prescribed cocaine to be bluntly honest. Labled for no real reason at all as the sole basis for diagnosis is the behaviors they are not exhibiting.

I just wanted to clear this up as i think you should read more about this from all sides of the issue try some books. If you are going to get your kid labled you should know just what you are doing to your child, before you do it.

Sorry Mandi i didn’t make myself clear i am in uk and the criteria is probably different from where you are it is a very prolonged process and they don’t just go by what the parents say the child also has to be difficult in school, and obviously lots of other symptoms like the hyperness, attention and normally a learning disability goes hand in hand with cross over of other disabilitys like autism, dyspraxia, aspergers etc i didn’t mean just the behaviour side of things also they are behind in other things like immaturity and communication, the teacher as to fill in a questionaire and send reports in but unbeknowingly to them who thought he was ok the professionals saw that he wasn’t as it was affecting his whole school life although they did write a paragraph that in their opinion he is just a little behind and frustrated, i didn’t know teachers could diagnose these days, multi tasking and i do know what you mean about kids behaviour but when your kid at 7 is tantruming because she can’t explain herself which is what a typical toddler does that is when you know something is wrong yes she does try it on like all kids do even children with disabilities do. I have read a lot up about it i just don’t want her to struggle and think it is her problem, i also know kids that had undiagnosed adhd so obviously no drugs or help and they struggled through schooling suffered depression and to top it all off one of the kids as just been diagnosed epileptic which apparantly kids that go undiagnosed can get this i think about 30% what i remember if i have facts right. Sharon x

Also could i mention adhd is real i know some of the behaviours if that all it is, can be a cry for attention and kids that are mentally abused can do this as well so i do know where you are coming from but when they are showing other symptoms which if not sorted out could cause problems into adulthood, over here they can get more help in school, as for the drug thing i don’t know i have heard bad things and good things everyone is individual, my daughter as just been diagnosed with reflux i suppose i shouldn’t put her on drugs for that, i have a low thyroid i shouldn’t be on drugs for that i would have commited suicide by now, my youngest daughter is on omeprazole and gaviscon i don’t like using drugs but other than mega disturbed nights which then affect their behaviour and intelligence and mine with little advice or support and lack of education what else is there to do, we go to professionals for help and take there advice and others not everyone is clued up. Sharon x

Actually, you may or may not be right about ADHD being real. To be blunt i don’t know if it is or is not. No one does. Not even the DSM. Why? Because there is nothing organic that can be pointed to that supports it’s existence. By the same token, i have never been presented with any evidence of any organic or scientifically measurable hard anything that would indicate that it does not exist. And this is a fact. But you don’t need to take it from me because NIMH has said it. I am simply going in accordance with the standard view. Which is that no one knows what it is. But for some reason some experts feel that some people display these symptoms. They choose to call these symptoms ADHD. They can link it to NOTHING organic. There is NOTHING in the DNA that they have yet produced that even shows that ADHD is genetic. (which it very well could be i have also not been presented with any evidence that it is not genetic. Though recent evidence has been documented that supports the view that bi polar is not genetic this was written up quite recently in some journal or other. And i know atleast one prominent doctor in Boston MA in the usa who declares that ADHD is just the way bi polar effects children.)

You can not get a clear answer as to weather anyone has it at the moment because there is no scientifically credible method of gathering measurable evidence of ADHD. But i am just an archaeologist married to PHD in theoretical physics, what can i possibly know about science? Even my husband was scandalized when he read about how it is diagnosed and what the standard procedures are for diagnoses and was horrified by the lack of evidence that testifies to it’s existance when you take into account that millions of children round the world are being pumped full of the equivalent of cocaine in it’s name. The fact remains in 1980 this LD was voted by a showing of hands into a disorder to be put in the DSM by a group of people sitting around together having a chat. What is more, the fact that it is listed as a disorder clearly speaks to the fact that there is no evidence of any scientifically measurable anything has been provided to prove it is anymore real than Santa Clause.

I happen to be labled with it yet i have been said by half the shrinks i see that i have it. The other half say i don’t. I have seen some in the same day just to see and said the same thing to both and exhibited the same behaviors to both. And these both harvard educated professionals came to very different conclusions as to weather or not i had it. As they are not really measuring anything at all. It is simply a matter of subjectiive opinion.

To my knowledge, no teacher can diagnose any such thing. However often in the usa teachers recommend very commonly parents take their kids in for testing. They are a critical part as so long as you have a single complaining teacher over the course of 12 years of study at any given point in that period of study, and so long as the parents freak out that a teacher is coming to them saying something could be wrong with their kid… Suddenly everything goes bonkers.

In highschool senior year second semester i had a friend. He was a straight A student except in math where he pulled C+ B-on average. Well his math teacher told his parents he might have ADHD. His parents decided to get him diagnosed. So he got letters from every teacher he has had since the first grade all of them documenting that he was a perfect student. However, at the umm “evaluation” (kangaroo court) they read only 1 letter before diagnosing him with ADHD while he went in and simply sat in silence the whole time refusing to respond as he didn’t want any part of it. And guess what? He sat there quietly and politely answered no questions refused like a good old fashioned quaker to get involved but was very peaceful. They labled this kid and they pumped him full of drugs. Now he has turrets symptoms that will never go away and his frontal lobe has shrunk by 4% as a result of the drugs. Sorry but that is not a diagnosis. That is child abuse.

Europe is less on the band wagon of feed children cocaine than the USA is. Something is apparently not right with your daughter. You are right to be worried and youa re right to be concerned and it makes logical sense that you take her in to have her figured out by professionals however, i wouldn’t say the ADHD word though if i were you. Instead i would look into language based learning disabilities because you may find if she gets help for those her behavior may begin to change rather significantly. If i were you this would be my first step and anyone that told me to medicate my 7 year old for ADHD i would give the finger to. If later after treatment for that things don’t gradually change, then in a couple years i might go back and have a second evaluation to see if they missed anything the first time. At which time if they said ADHD i would get several second opinions and then march myself to an herbalist and a psychologist and avoid all medication until my child’s developing brain was done developing at which point i may encourage my child to see someone to explore the possibility of medication and what it might have to offer.

Next, there is NO tie between ADHD and anything organic. Epilepsy is organic. I am sure there are some people with ADHD who do have or get epilepsy. However, these to things are by no means linked i would know as i have taken the time to study what i have been labled with in extensive detail. I did not come to my conclusions over night but i began my reasearch nearly 15 years ago. Since then i read everything. All the studies i have seen no such study. And even if it did exist i would question who payed for it and how many similar studies before it had been stopped as the results were not to the drug company’s liking. Along with researching my own LD i have researched this field in exhorbitant detail. And then there is the fact that i study ancient dead hominids and one of the critical things i study is the brain. I am not brain surgeon but my grasp of the brain is better than that of the average person as a result of my profession. So, as i said if i were you i would look into the language issue leave the ADHD thing alone for now and maybe revisit it depending on the results of dealing with the language issue.

And as you pointed out that i am american i would have you know i have lived all over the world and am presently iN Vienna’s posh 8th district of bohoness. I have spent time in UK and in korea and finland sweden and canada among other places. And though the USA has the m0ost messed up system of ADHD diagnosis in the world the UK system in recent history has been gradually gaining.

You are correct as well there can be other causes of the behaviors of ADHD. Such as various forms of abuse. Also over 400 physical and scientifically measurable health problems of a wide variety.

You have a low thyroid and it causes depression for you? Am i understanding that right? Yes you SHOULD treat that with medication. You are treating something that they can show you that they can test for organically. ADHD is different. It isn’t the same in that respect you are medicating the brain with cocaine which is not good for anyone’s brain sorry it is not. What is more no one has ever presented evidence that the ADHD brain is in point of fact different from that of the normal brain. They can find and they have presented no difference between the 2. It is a fact the medications for ADHD effect those with ADHD the exact same way as they effect those with out it. But don’t take my word. I am sure DRHD someone who sometimes posts here who seems to be quite well versed in this stuff would tell you the same thing i am saying here, bevcause it is true. What is more, these drugs STOP working after roughly 3 years of use. In that time they have been known to and proven to shrink the frontal lobe (self editing center of the brain also responsible for logic) in some cases they cause life long turretts symptoms, weight loss or gain heart problems. (I had to stand in a school hallway when i was only a few years older than your daughter courtesy of ritalin while a good friend of mine died of heart failure caused by said ritalin.) I would argue that the costs out weigh the pros. Especiallyy as medication is only a temporary fix of upto 3 years.

I don’t know what is wrong with your other daughter nor am i well versed in any LDs besides the 2 i have been said to have one of which i do consider quite legitimate. Dyslexia and ADHD. So it could be that whatever is going on with your other daughter, she truly is better off on the medication she is on. But for ADHD, it is generallyy not a good idea. Lastly, the brain in children is developing. We don’t understand the brain as well as we would like yet. For that reason, it seems like a poor idea to pump a child’s brain full of cocaine. If when the brain is still not working right and it is fullyy developed then maybe it is a better time to put chemicals into it as something truly isn’t right. It could still develop out of this phase at some point until it is done developing no matter how unlikely you might think it is. it still could happen. And this is why i say drugging for ADHD in vast general BAD idea. Atleast for children as none of these drugs were ever actually designed to be used on the brains of children. These drugs were designed for adults. So sorry but it smells bad to me. Also getting a child a lable like ADHD causes problems later down the line that parents never stop to consider. They want to make sure their kid gets the best education which is great. You should do that. But you should not forget, that these lables get many people fired fromt heir jobs, and make it more difficult for them to find work, even when they are fully and effectively treated. People have alot of fear of the ADHD diagnosed. So think long and hard and carefully first. Think that having your daughter diagnosed with ADHD could make her unable to work so what is it that you are working so hard to get her educated for??? It seems better to first treat the language issues and then maybe later revisit ADHD if things are still a mess. But that is just my thoughts on the matter after living through this diagnosis and hearing the stories of the far less fortunate. Seriously you should read the adults with LD section of this forum in detail before you havve this done to your child. (ADHD diagnosis) but the speech thing you need to nip in the butt.

Best of luck!

Thank you Mandi that was a lot more informative i know i don’t want her labelled i just need her looked at and get help as i don’t want her struggling in education and also rest of her life, i know some that have had probably adhd undiagnosed and other learning disabilities can go onto have a normal life ok they end up in low paid jobs as no qualifictions and can’t afford/scared to go college to help with education but i also know a lot of drug users that were the same obviously to seek solice being out of it so to speak. Depression is another big issue with a lot of them, alcoholics as they need to drink to socialise as they aren’t as bravado as they make out, we could go on and on. I do know what you are saying on the job front though putting a label on them makes employers judge them as hard work employees, but then if not helped no one could understand them and they could go into depression and take sick leave all the time which also makes them unemployable you can’t win, sometimes it is hard to know what to do for the best, i think a lot of people from my age group have had problems that when undiagnosed and i know loads that can’t read or write, unemployed as have mental illness and medicated sometimes i think society is to blame as it is so fast forward no wonder there is more mental health issues it is probably all parents having nervous breakdowns due to over stress that it is reflecting on their own children. Thanks again Mandi. Sharon x

She has sensory issues. She probably has Hyper muscle tone. Read the book “The Out of Sync Child” by Carol Kranowitz.

The school can provide occupational therapies. They can give her weighted vest to wear 20 minutes on and 20 minutes off. She can also get a wiggle pad which is a squooshy pad to put on the seat so she can have more attention in class. Also, if she doesn’t sleep at night, you can try a weighted blanket. Her body is seeking pressure. Things like swinging, rolling in a blanket, trampoline, playing with shaving cream or playdo are all techniques to redirect the nervous system. A private occupational therapist might also suggest the brushing and joint compressions to calm her down. She can also wear her socks inside out so the seam doesn’t bother her.

I’m suprised no one picked up on her sensory issues. Let us know what you think.

Well i think you make some great points Shaz, and i know you are trying so hard to do the best thing for your child. So keep it up. And i agree on alot of what you say.

But the bit about more mental health problems than there used to be i can’t agree with you on that. The reason is this, the brain doesn’t change that quickly. More disease of the mind could not have evolved in humans so suddenly. This makes 0 evolutionary sense. For that reason alone, i know that is a fallacy. What i also know is that there are doctors and drug companies lobbying congress and other government systems out there for more and more leeway to sell their product. As a result, we see more and more mental health defects. it is not in actuallity that we have more it is that they are lumping “symptoms” together more and more and giving them a name to market their products. Doctors get on board for the free vacations and “speaking fees” etc… it is the newest cotton industry in history at this time, most specifically bi polar and ofcourse ADHD. Those 2 have to be 2 of the most major money makers for big pharma and for doctors who are given atleast int he united states and to a lesser degree in other countries but in those too a small sum of money for every child medicated. That is the larger reason we see such an increase in people with psych issues.

I agree many of these so called behaviors parents are accidentally teaching their children and it likely is noithing more than that. For example a recent paper directly disproves that bi polar is genetic and infact it is more clearly tied to child abuse victims.

I think too though again my knoweledge is limited to what i have and to the long studies i have done on the industry, that Annette may be onto something this time. You might want to think seriously about her suggestion as it just might help your daughter.

Good luck

Hi thank you Annette i think they were too quick to fob me off as a neurotic mum due to me and her dad splitting up and using that as the reason for her problems. But i was also quite weak at the time, physically and mentally drained so to be honest not much fight power i should have put my foot down, even the teacher was making out she was fine she was doing ok, if she was doing ok then why didn’t she sit the sats test, because she couldn’t read or write that is why, but obviously that is ok, she is in the bottom 5 out of 68 children 2 are definately below her one is autistic and another is looking like he may be she is the only girl in the bottom 5 i only know as i know all the parents. I went to added classes with her and this were for children struggling and they thought the reason being was because we weren’t doing anything 10 were invited but only 5 turned up and we were consistent showing that we did care about their education they then tested us to see if they get it from us, i was a bright child, i did struggle at school more to do with lack of understanding and being scared to ask the teacher i know if i would have had the confidence i would have excelled i have now a lot of qaulifactions i did go to uni but due to children i found it very hard and i noticed i didn’t spend quality time with my children so after a year i dropped out i did pass the year though it is hard.

Hi thanks again Mandi yes i know what you are saying as in the “olden days” people just kept quiet things weren’t allowed to be in the open if they were struggling due to being shoved in the mental home and drugged to the eyeballs and then life would never be the same so they daren’t come out of the woodwork also it wasn’t socially acceptable whereas now they are encouraged to be open and problems are dealt with so that is why there are more mental health issues which is society related as we allow it, which isn’t a bad thing but everyone is individual some try and deal with it themselves, as for adhd children i remember children in my class being the same i don’t know what became of them but i remember them as being well known with the behaviour then in high school they were hardly ever there so i can’t see it being too good probably left with no exam results i do feel for them, they do these sats to see who is falling behind and get more help to get them up to the standards but obviously some children need more help and different learning stratergies. My daughter as always been in the bottom table and i do know that a lot of her behaviour is probably due to frustration as i do think she is a bright child it is the reading and the writing that is letting her down she obviously sees things differently as she reads the maths numbers back to front if 2 digits, all her fine motor skills are delayed she still struggles with knife and fork, riding bikes without stableizers on but my older daughter was 10 before she got it, getting dressed like the buttons and zips she still struggles with also cutting paper apparantly it says in her report she needs to practice to help with her fine motor skills, basically i knew she was going to be behind due to her speech being behind she was nearly 3 and half before she could be understood and even then she got sentences wrong way around, she now says hew for new, husic for music, cuitar for guitar mem for them men for then and a lot more but speech therapist said that she is within age limit to be still doing this and then found that her expressive and receptive language is 2yrs behind which she said can be normal as some children don’t develop it as quickly as others waiting for another appt as i said i want one otherwise she would have dismissed her, she is doing all this behaviour but yet they say she is ok, i don’t get it and then some kids get everything???? I think they think she will come on after a while because of me and her dad splitting i really think they have got it into their heads that is the problem they are so wrong. The saying can’t see the wood for the trees comes to mind, sorry i am rambling but as you can see i am frustrated with the system i find that once they judge they get there heads together and come out with a wrong answer i am summoning my strength ready for the next fight but this time i will be ready for them they won’t know what as hit them. Thanks again for the replys. Sharon x

Now what you are deescribing is dyslexia or something similar to it. There is a really good system called The Orton Guillingham Method, for learning to read. I know about it and alot more about dyslexia as i have studied it quite well too since i have it.

There are 3 things i have studied for the last 15 years in disturbing detail.

1. ADHD
2. The system of mental health treatment for LD and psych issues
3. Dyslexia

Beyond those 3 things i do not know a goddess forsaken thing about LD. Because nothing else really applies to me, and there were more important things i wanted to study also.

This is the last assistance you are going to get from me. I have issues every day due to creationists who respond with such denial to the truth of evolution as you respond to the truth about mental health issues and history of the mental health profession. This is something i have studied in gross detail just as i have evolution. I really find it insufferable when people deliberately misunderstand what i am telling them because i am trying to do them a favor so that their child does not become one of the thousands in this world every year that is abused by the mental health profession. So for the sake of your child i will explain this one last time, i will hope you get it. Not because i think you should but for your child’s well being.

The facts are facts. DNA mutates over time. However it does NOT mutate enough no where near it to cause the kind of rise in spych issues we are seeing today. The amount of mentally ill or disordered today is staggering and horrendous and can not be legit because hard science and biology indicates alot of it anyway is total crap. The brain, can not evolve or change in the species so suddenly as it seems to have according to mental health as that would take…. vast numbers of generations. Infact the brain is quite the same as it was when the first sapien sapiens discovered fire and created the wheel. Virtually no change since then upto the present day. There fore again a rise in psych issues that people are having as those issues are located in the brain can not be happening at such a steep incline in number and amount.

You are right, a small incline is probably justified by the modern times we live in the available treatments and the openess of present society. However, that increase wouldn’t be the equivalent of 1 third of the mental health issues we are seeing today. Many of these modern learning issues or psych issues are called “disorders” NOT diseases. The reason they are called that is because the scientific evidence does not in point of fact back up their existence. However, it is hugely proffitable to lump behaviors or traits together at this time in history and create a lable and a “medication” for it. This would account for well over 2 thirds of the rise in mental health related issues that we see in the long run in recent history. Today the drug companies are even lobbying congress so that they can screen every mother in america for mental health issues when she gets pregnant and drug her during pregnancy and just after she gives birth. It is called The Mother’s Act which was renamed The Melanie something or other mother’s act. I have read it personally the kinds of abuses it leaves itself open to are astronomical and that is how big pharma likes it. Not only that, but they don’t have to tell you they are screening you for depression or any other psyych issues. This is not only to be applied to women with a history of serious or even mild psych issues. This is to be applied to *ALL* women in america. That means women will be given drugs like prozac and paxil and depacote etc *WHILE* pregnant and nursing. I am sorry but there is simply no way that is healthy. And now because big pharma is pushing for this it has become very proffitable for doctors to say that it is perfectly healthy in america, many of them. But we all know what happens to drug addicted babies. It also encourages the drugging of mothers with ritalin which is just cocaine legally perscribed and they are maintaining it is *healthy.* But it simply doesn;t make sense as for years we heard about the dangers of doing drugs while pregnant. Just because they are prescribed these are still hardcore chemicals that CAN and WILL effect our babies. So i am sorry if i for 1 am against this bill because it doesn’t make sense. The drug companies have also been saying it is all genetic. I have also explained to you why that is bullox. Recently a study was done that says otherwise. It is 1 study and it shocked everyone when it came back. I will wait for futher studies to be done as a scientist i need verification but this study suggests it is nurture rather than nature that mayy be causiing alot of mental health issues also.

American children atre the most drugged in the world in the name of education. Yet a fairly recent studies shows finnish children who have never popped a pill in their lives, who spend less time in school who do less homework as a standard who are extremely rarely labled who’s teachers are nearly all of them trained to teach both LD and mainstream classes are the best educated in the world when they are even investing less than we are in the education of their children. It isn’t about the money we pour in or the drugs we pour in. It is about how we structure and educate in the usa. The fact is, we don’t. We use up 90% of the world’s supply of ritalin almost all of it on school age children so that they will learn better yet our children rank as the least well educated in the western world. So then just what are these drugs really doing for any of them as none of them is getting an education here with or without them tto compete with. But lets also look at another recent study that indicates dutch children are the happiest in the western world finnish children in the top 5 and american children once again at the bottom of the list as least happy. Pretty scary that. It would indicate the break down is not in the minds of children but rather in other areas of their lives. And it is the fault of the adults who don’t insist on something better for all children in the USA as children remain voiceless.

The problems with the system of mental health in the usa are the greatest problems with mental health in the world at this time. Due to the money changing hands every which way and the drug companies lobbying congress for 2 for 1 deals (that is what the mother’s act is) drug the mother drug the baby when it is born diagnose the baby commence drugging after all the apple can’t fall far from the tree. That is true in the cases of some mental ilnesses that seem to actually be based in something genetic or findable in the brain. But they are also talking about stuff like ADHD. Recently in the boston area of MA, a 2 year old died of a drug cocktail for ADHD. This story is becoming too common. A 7 year old in florida killed himself in the bathroom of his foster home because no one listened when he told them that his drug cocktail caused him severe depression. The Virginia Tech shooter was on something too though his psych records disapeared right after that the doctor who had been treating them literally hid them at his house for months. Probably because he was doing some tests with drugs on this poor kid without his family knowing about it as here in the states the doctors do NOT legally have to disclose such tests. But due to the outcome he likely thought it was prudent to try and hide his involvement but this is speculation as they have only found the records what they contain still remains in large part unkown to the public. Likely this doctor was receiving a large sum from the drug companies to test whatever it was he was likely giving to the virginia tech killer. Because that is standard in such situations of testing drugs. People made billions in the 80s and early 90s when ritalin was still experimental running tests of just such a nature. This is an amazingly corrupt industry that seeks to treat symptoms not their underlieing causes as they realize doing that and curing those in the cases in which those exist would hurt their business. They have lobby groups in washington in a desperate attempt to sell dangerous drugs to young children. Typically it is said you can’t diagnose ADHD till a child is 6 or 7. I know many younger than 4 with this diagnosis. Today there are even websites saying to you to have your INFANT diagnosed and given ritalin if it uhhh “cries” when it is in physical pain. So if you are going to deliberately misunderstand what i am saying to you then you are no better than a creationist and i don’t have any more time to spare on you or trying to help you. But i wanted to explain it one last time in hopes that you get it. Because if you don’t get it, it is your children that could and will suffer later on.

Good luck.

I agree its all complicated. Maybe services in the UK are different than the US.

I was born in 1965. There was no such help for kids in school. Even if parents wanted help, there was nothing available in the 1970’s. Everybody with a mental problem was labeled with “schizophrenia”. Depression was not recognized and/or not treated.

From my reading on developmental books, 20 years worth of research has been done going backwards. Taking an adult who is jobless and/or in the criminial system. Going back to problems in school and as far back as preschool and infancy. The same data is true for those in the mental health system. Taking the crazy adult, going back to learning problems in school, family problems and trackable behaviors back in toddler years.

Today, the US has Early Intervention Programs. It is believed that if we can change some of this crap in the early years, our child can grow to be a competant adult and may not have to be a dropout from school and in the criminal system or mental health system.

I, personally, believe that these therapies and school interventions helped my kids. I believe my son could be that basket case of a child had we not had the opportunity for therapies. I believe there is alot of hope for kids as they grow into adults and hope for society as a whole.

Over a long period of time, things change. Take one day at a time with your kids to address the issues little by little. You will have alot of knowledge to offer someone else that you know.

Thank you Mandi i do understand and i do get where you are coming from, all i am saying there are other perspectives also but i do know what you are saying about druging kids that is the easy option but not an helpful one and like you say will probably do more harm than good in the long run, i don’t know about the program to give all women drugs whilst pregnant that is scandalous and it will cause an uproar, i know with hormone changes can cause depression but if they put them all on prozac society will not be the same, i know what you are saying about brains are still the same but it isn’t to say that toxins in our systems cannot change our behaviour it is our bodies not coping with chemicals on foods or intolerances, easy option foods for the super fast forward living haven’t time to cook etc, but anyway we could go on forever i do agree with what you say about drugs solutions, i am suspecting dyslexia she has got another speech therapy appt next week see how it goes and what the lady says. Thanks again.

Annette thank you for your words, there is supposed to be early intervention here but obviously some can fall through the net, what gets me if they are saying all these problems are caused by me and her dad splitting up then why not give her help???? Sharon x

I don’t know why your splitting up with her dad, was brought out as the cause of your daughter’s problems. It’s hard to respond appropriately to that question without implying competency issues of the therapist or whomever you are seeing. I think, sometimes all of us, even professsionals see 1 thing and focus on it. Whereas, a really good physician, will look deeper, research more and take into account the whole development of the child over a period of years since infancy. Sometimes, good help is hard to find.
[Modified by: annette10dance on July 27, 2009 01:11 PM]

Hi Annette i know and thank you for your support. At the time i was also under a lot of stress due to my daughter and work and the split up so was weak and no fight left in me, but now i am going on a parenting course and the psychologist said if i felt there was still a problem after parenting course to go back which obviously i will be doing as i know it is more than parenting skills that is going on and if she trys to fob me off again i will fight back as i am a lot stronger now. Thank you again. Sharon x

Hi thank you Macc and Mandi again, i have now found out that she has had a irlens test which apparantly some teachers have the qualifications to do so and she is found to need a pink ovelay to help her, so that is a start but funny thing is she is now doing what she used to and getting words wrong way around again ie saw was, no on and like always still gets b and d mixed up even in her surname. Numbers she is still the same in i thought she had problems with reading it she also has it through sound so it must be the processing of numbers ie i told her i was 38 so she then said 83 so i said no 38 so she then said yes 8 and 3 make 83 so god knows what is going on there? I am going to ask for a ed psychologist to come in to make sure that all her problems are found out and catered for as a class teacher won’t be able to assess her properly whilst dealing with 30 odd other children. Although i could have a word with the teaching assisstant who does small group work with her and the other children struggling. Apparantly she told Melissa she is in her own world sometimes which she does switch off, but that is Melissa. Mandi i wouldn’t put her on drugs anyway as i can deal with her behaviour now i aren’t as stressed and finding ways of coping and now school are now realising there is a problem so i don’t feel as neurotic, i still need to go to gp about her bed wetting issues. Thanks for your replies. Sharon x

With early identification, effective instruction, and minor adaptations, most children with an LD can become as successful as any other member of society.General aspects of learning can also be measured and used to determine the level at which individuals might be expected to apply adaptive strategies. A number of relatively new assessment technologies are able to evaluate a learner’s ability to recognize and represent meaning in different forms.

Yes why should it be improtant to ADHD diagnosis that parehnts have split up.

Simply put, unrest at home causes reactions in children and often bad behavior as the home situation has become very hard on them and caused them a great deal of missery. They react to that. That, is not ADHD. That, is NATURAL. The thing about ADHD is it tends to have to be present in atleast 2 different areas of life. Typically for children home and school. And if home isn’t right or something is happening at home and the child is reacting often that reaction even spills into the other area of life as well. And as a result a child can be misdiagnosed and then medicated for something they don’t even really exhibit even the symptoms for. I have no idea if this is the case here. But someone didn’t see the relevance to the home situation to the diagnosis well hopefully this clarifies it for you.

Hi Shaz.I am a mom with 3 boys that also have had problems with reading and being hyper. They went thru school without being diagnosed because there problems were not so severe. It did affect there school work and there social life in the playground. I now regret not insisting at school to get them tested. They are in high school and still struggling but have learned to cope. Have you been able to get a diagnosis for your 7yr. old daughter yet? If the school is too slow maybe if you went thru your family doctor he could get the ball running by providing you with a note so you could take it to school or even outside help to identify what the problem may be.A learning disability is a neurological disorder which is usually present from birth and these learning disabilities can involve basic reading, basic comprehension,listening, expressive or receptive language, written expression, writing, math, social skills,attention and memory.I hope you can get some sort of help because this is probably stressing you and your family.These learning disabilities are all treatable.Hang in there and don’t give up because you are the only one that can advocate for your children.Hope to hear good news from you.

Hi Saoz thank you for that. I have been on the parenting course it is a webster stratton course and works on play and positive, i do play with her but i had gotten into the negative cycle and picked up on negative behaviours. Melissa as responded well to positive praise and works fairly well. Although she still is fairly naughty but a lot of it is down to not listening, understanding, but it has brought us closer which i am grateful for.

Mandi yes i know when parents split up it can affect their behaviour and that some kids do act out. But Melissas behaviour to be honest started when she was around 18mths, the hyperness started, then the lack of communication, no babbling, pointing or waving greetings, so it isn’t something to do with us splitting up. And she does act out at school just not mega bad, she does attention seeking behaviours, immature, touchy feely, very energetic, impulsive. So it isn’t just at home, but i think a lot of it is to do with routine and consistency which with 4 children and working and running the full caboodle even when her dad was at home as he was a lazy good for nothing, who left everything to me, and her baby sister with severe reflux getting up 40 odd times a night no joking every 10mins screaming for the first 1yr of her life before medicated and then she stopped breathing twice, not good, so it all took its toll and because Melissa was already behind in speech and language it took a mega affect on her school work and behaviour, if they listened to me and took me seriously this would have been dealt with and they could have put procedures in place at school to help her. I am now learning to get into a routine as she does like routines and be more consistant in her punishment and positive praise. Sharon x

Ok, the hyperness would worry me not at all. babies are hyper. That is just part of parenting. But at that age…. no pointing waving speach or babbling… that would be a clear sign something is wrong.

Kids are supposed to be energetic and impulsive and immature that is why we call them KIDS instead of adults! And attention seeking behavior indicates she needs attention she isn’t receiving in some way or perhaps from you??? Or her father??? We don’t simply call them kids because they are vertically challenged…. As for touchy feely, i am going to bet that has been developing with the split up. It stands to reason since it is a sign that she is having attachment issues which makes perfectly good sense when her parents are splitting up or just split up. Let me explain hyper in children and also impulsive in children. They are physically designed to be that way. Everyone who knows how the brain is constructed knows, the frontal lobe in children is not fully developed therefore no child is able to self edit like an adult can. That comes with the slow progressive developing of the frontal lobs. So if your child is impulsive and hyper congrats you have a healthy kid! You simply have a kid. That region of the brain isn’t done developing till the mid 20s. Different peoples brains develop in different ways at somewhat different rates.

maybe some help at school would be good, can i ask is your home bilingual? Because if so the speech issues you perceived as a baby may not qualify as a delay. It is common in bilingual and multilingual households for babies to speak fairly late. Usually too when they do they speak some in both languages.

the problem is it is really hard to be a single mother with 2 children would be nice if they were all grown up you have so much work to do all single mothers do it is unbelievably difficult.Schools, are machines, not institutions of learning. there is no real room in their constuction as a system for the children they are designed to educate.

On a slightly other topic…. I have made a rule in my home for when we have children here. I think every parent would be wise to adopt it.

children need time to be children and our society has been stripping that away from them far too much far too long. So… I have decided when i have children in my home, that in highschool i will have a daily 2 hour max for homework. And that means time my child is actually working on homework. Timer stops for every break. Should my child receive more than 2 hours of homework her teacher will get a nasty note from me. The principal will receive a complaint about over load and my child will receive a note of polite apology and a request by me to the teacher for an extension as in my home we do homework 2 hours a night only and that is our rule. That means if my child at 16 has 6 classes a day, total for that day she is responsible for 2 hours of homework to give someone under the age of 18 more homework than that seems to me to be…. not teaching but torturing and abusing and denying my child their childhood. i would encourage parents for the health and well being of their children to adopt such a policy.

Hi Shaz.Has your daughter been formally assessed? If not it is important that she is assessed formally. With a proper diagonsis she can get the support to help her. Children with a learning disability can have problems with social skills.Her behaviour in school may also have to do with her inability to do well academically. She may be lacking in social skills and these need to be addressed and taught. Children with social skill deficits do not know what they are doing wrong when enteracting in a social situation. If a child is acting in appropriately we can 1. Ask her to explain what happened. 2. Ask her to identify the mistake. 3. Assist her in identifying what she did wrong because she probably will not know. 4.Explain to her that she should not do this and then explain to her how she should have behaved. Social errors are not intentional. Positive feedback changes behaviour, negative feedback only stops behaviour temporarily. Children with learning disabilities have average to above average intelligence and they can learn with the proper support, assistance and positive feedback. They do not need to be discouraged by negative feedback. They are already struggling with low self-esteem issues because they can see that they are a bit different from their classmates. I think that we get all wrapped up in how we feel and forget that our child is also suffering and does not know how to help themselves.

Hi saoz no she hasn’t been assessed, she has been seen by a speech therapist who puts her two years behind in receptive and expressive speech, so is still under a speech therapist. Well things have changed a little at school, went to parents evening and they now realise there is a problem she is on the SEN register but also now as and iep with 5 targets on it, a small group of them are taken out of class as they can’t be taught with them as it will confuse them as they are that far behind their peers, she even goes out with just herself and another boy to play on the computer she says. I spoke to the senco who was really nice and i said i was concerned she may be dyslexic, they said they don’t test for dyslexia but can check for irlens, which is the colour dyslexia, but he is going to check her pen/pencil grip as i said she complains after holding the pencil for a while, she struggles with fine motor skills also.

Mandi thanks for your reply, i know some children crave for attention but she gets a lot of attention from me, but she wants more. The hyperness can be related to learning difficulties/disabilities also. Amount of people have asked if she has adhd, she is more abnormally hyer not just a little, can’t sit still fidgets even when doing school work, her attention span is very short. I do agree with you about kids being kids and parenting issues are more important to me i do lots for my kids and anyone can’t believe why i am on the parenting course as a lot of it is to do with parents that aren’t bothered and swear/curse at their children and threaten and abuse them, i am the opposite i take them for picnics, bake ok i picked the negative behaviour out but so do a lot of others it doesn’t make their kids hyper, but Melissa as liked the positive approach and i must admit i do, so that is one thing i have picked up from teh parenting course.
Melissa is getting a little better socially she loves to be around other kids it is new situations even if some kids are there who she knows she doesn’t like, but if i warn her enough she is a little better in them situations but she still needs me for encouragement to go with them, this is when she hits me also but i realise it is the extreme anxiety that causes her to hit out, although i know it is wrong and do punish her for it but i know what causes her to do it, which the people who run the parenting class are impressed with, knowing why a child is acting the way they are is a good sign, see before i started analyzing Melissa as the psychologist put it i was always putting her on naughty step, bed and it was a continuous thing all day everyday, but it didn’t sort her behaviour out, but then when i thought maybe something is wrong and the more i looked the more i realised what were causing her behaviours and finding coping mechanisms, ie in middle of winter she wanted to wear a summer skirt with flimsy shoes, the screaming tantrums i dealt with. Now i put alll summer shoes skirts, tops etc away so she only has choice of winter clothes, also socks she just wears tights or nothing as socks make her tantrum due to the lines in them, tights don’t fall down so much so don’t make lines. Walking to school, she now rides her bike it is so lovely not to have tantrums, which then stressed me out for the day. She is also getting a little better with the homework, so gettting there slowly and i think it is to do with the positive praise. But it won’t help with the learning disability, she has a star chart at school as well to help her and golden time and stickers which is what i do at home as well as positive praise it does help. Thanks again. Sharon x

hmm sounds like you are handling stuff better good. Sounds like your child likes the new aproach too. Also great. You seem to be seeing some improvement. I am really happy for you, but more importantly for your daughter who as a result is likely suffering less ickiness then she was before.
The reason i say that is because i tend to believe 50% of the issues related to ld in children roughly speaking anyway really are symptoms of something is actually wrong with them. I think though that what is really wrong gets exasterbated quite frequently by the chemicals forced down their throats and the treatments that can be quite cruel or dehumaizing or just somehow personality numbing methods. In which case who wouldn’t rebel and i think a large percentage of the symptoms are also just that the rebellion against the poor methods we have of dealing with many forms of LD.

As for being asked by people if she has ADHD, i see a kid every day on the side of the road different kid each time jumping out of it’s skin hyper as anything and i just think my god what is wrong with this kid? Does it have ADHD? The fact is, this is a completely subjective diagnosis. There is exactly 0 physical evidence that has ever been supplied and not refuted for this disorder. Next point of contention i have is your statement “so gettting there slowly and i think it is to do with the positive praise. But it won’t help with the learning disability,” Actually NIMH studies are showing behavior modification therapies and parenting styles are as effective and in many cases if not all more effective in the long term than medications. So that statement, though you might believe it if your child in point of fact is ADHD as you think she is, is completely incorrect. There is nothing in your childs DNA sequence nor in your child’s brain they can conclusively point to in the case of ADHD that is in any way shape or form distinguishable from that of a normal brain. And that is a fact. You can disagree with that fact all you like…. So let me offer you another example of fact verses fiction to help you understand what i am trying to say.

I am an archaeology student. So a great one for me to point to as an analogy for denying the facts of physical reality is the issue of creationism and evolution. There are some who want to believe it is a debate and that their side is correct and that the other side is wrong. Here is a fact, we have endless physical proof dug up from in the ground that proves that humans and everything else evolved. Evolution is not the theory of how it all began that is the big bang. Evolution is solely about how we all developed. So if someone wants to think God set the universe in motion and used evolution as the mechanism for human development i can’t prove they are wrong. But if they want to deny that evolution happened altogether i can always whack them in the head with a homo erectus femur and ask them “Oh really, you sure???” Creationism wants to think itself science but it isn’t because they can’t prove anything in a physical sense. Evolution can prove in physical reality that evolution happened. So it really isn’t a debate.

The analogy is to help you to understand believing in ADHD is the equivalent of being a creationist. Having blind faith in something that lacks all physically measurable evidence. As a humanities student that uses science constantly as the method i use to study what we find from the past, it is impossible for me anyway to believe in something with no physical and physically measurable proof of it. If you don’t have this problem that i do great for you. Just understand, ADHD like creationism lacks the physical proof necesary to make it a legitimate scientific diagnosis so it is simply a subjective diagnosis. Just as creationism is a subjective belief. Why not believe the irish Dagda created everything or the egyptian god Osiris??? Or the greek god Zeus… You see? Totally a subjective belief. But the physical reality is the physical reality and there is just no way around that hard fact.

So if you wish to believe that is up to you. I just wanted to show this to you in an analogy that may make you stop and think hard about some of what you are saying.

I wish you and your child all the best and hope things continue to get better as i suspect they will on account of the phuysical reality of as we age our brains develop, which means hers has been developing too in a way indistinguishable from that of a normal brain.

But anyway good luck.

Hi Shaz,

Are you having an occupational therapy assessment for the sensory integration and fine motor issues? You can get a referral through your GP.

Another avenue to try is adjustments to diet. Some kids who are hyperactive respond very well if trigger foods/additives are removed from their diet. The fidgeting can go almost overnight. Google Feingold diet or food allergies, hyperactivity and you will find a load of information. Supplementation with fish oil can also help.

If you suspect dyslexia you should also push for testing though you may find you have to pay for a private assessment.

Good luck. You’ll find that your are your daughter’s greatest advocate on this journey. You’ll need to research, push and determine what the best strategies/therapies are for her. The expertise is very fragmented both in the UK and US, so it comes down to parents. And if you get good support in school, count yourself lucky (as I was with my son) as this is not always the case. MACC

I wanted to share this with you Shaz, i just discovered it….

http://health.usnews.com/blogs/on-parenting/2009/03/27/adhd-drugs-dont-help-children-long-term.html

“no on and like always still gets b and d mixed up even in her surname.”

Sounds to me like classic dyslexia. Here is a trick i have, as a dyslexic with B and D, they are hardest when they are lower case letters. Take your hands and hold them up to eye level so you are looking at your palms rather than the back of your hands. Then, roll up your 4 fingers and point your thumbs in the air. You are then looking at B and D. If she can think of D as right that way and B as left… Or if you can teach her to associate D with her right hand and B with her left, it is an ever lasting self checking mechanism. I still use it today sometimes though usually i don’t need to anymore. With on and no though sorry you are on your own….

She isn’t connecting the symbols with what is they are visually describing. You must teach her this concept of 38 try blocks for teaching math that are made showing all the pieces that make up the whole sort of a thing. Then show her the 8 so she understands the reference. See if that helps….

“Mandi i wouldn’t put her on drugs anyway as i can deal with her behaviour now i aren’t as stressed and finding ways of coping and now school are now realising there is a problem so i don’t feel as neurotic”

Yes this actually what i think many parents experience with various LDs. Then they have freak outs and wind up having their kids medicated because they are neurotic not because there is something truly *that* wrong with their kids that a little interventional education therapy couldn’t fix no chemicals included. That is part of why i take such a strong stance against medicating. Because parents are medicating the wrong person for the wrong problem in my opinion about 8 and a half times out of 10.

But you are right, something isn’t normal here. I think though that you are looking at some issues probably related to the split and maybe some attachment stuff fromt hat maybe??? Just speculating and some very real dyslexia would be my guess. Bu i am no expert in child psych i do know dyslexia pretty well though. It doesn’t have to all be as devestating as they claim. So you are doing well just hang in there and get to the bottom of the issues. You will, it will just take some time and effort, then you will know what your child really needas, and i have a strong feeling it will not be a pill for ADHD, and likely not for anything else either i would guess… Unless there is a pill to inhibite the bladder while one sleeps… Otherwise… who knows…

But i am really glad you are starting to figure this out and that you feel you are getting your footing. The more secure you present yourself as feeling the safer and the more secure your child is going to feel. You are doing a very good job at this point navigating something difficult and you should be proud of yourself.

Hi .. I wanted to jump in and offer up another perspective to you. What caught my eye was your posting about your child being diagnosed with reflux.

Have you thought about researching for leaky gut syndrome? I thought you might want to research this wellness center. [url]http://www.drmagaziner.com/Magaziner-Center/DrAllanMagaziner.asp [/url] It has been recommended by some of my clients. I am taking my son there this March for a wellness checkup.

Sometimes, if your child has leaky gut or food allergies, the nervous system and brain can be impacted negatively.

I thought you might like to have this contact in your collection of resources.

Blessings,

Colleen Bain, M.A.
Enhanced Learning Skills for Kills, LLC
http://www.els4kids.com